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Author Topic: Why and how Mohayanas and "Buddhist" justify killing and stealing.  (Read 1721 times)

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Offline Johann

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Atma recently came to get known the "reddit-Buddhism " social network for hungry ghosts and there in this, like in most Buddhist forum the Moha-yana dominates. On how those "heroes" justify their ways of killing and stealing might be more clear if one reads their Suttas, lies and reply's on topics like euthanasia and dealing with Dhamma. This wired sect, calling themselves "Buddhists" is even more dangerous as a radical Taliban organization.

Quote from: deathnate4 on ratdit

    The Skill In Means ([An]Upayakausalya) Sutra, as translated by Mark Tatz, goes like this:

    Then the Lord [Buddha] again addressed the Bodhisattva Jnanottara: “Son of the family: Once a upon a time, long before the Thus-come-one, the Worthy, the fully perfected Buddha Dipamkara, there were five hundred merchants who set sail on the high seas in search of wealth. Among the company was a doer of dark deeds, a doer of evil deeds, a robber well-trained in the art of weaponry, who had come on board that very ship to attack them. He thought, “I will kill all these merchants when they have achieved their aims and done what they set out to do, take all possessions and go to Jambu Continent.”

    “Son of the family: then the merchants achieved their aims and set about to depart. No sooner had they done so, than that deceitful person thought: “Now I will kill all these merchants, take all their possessions and go to Jambu Continent. The time has come.” At the same time, among the company on board was a captain named Great Compassionate. While Captain Great Compassionate slept on one occasion, the deities who dwelt in that ocean showed him in a dream: ‘’’Among this ship’s company is a person named so and so, of such and such sort of physique, of such and such, garb, complex, and shape—a robber mischievous, a thief of others’ property. He is thinking,” I will kill all these merchants, take all their possessions and go to Jambu Continent.”

    To kill these merchants would create formidable evil karma for that person. Why so? These five hundred merchants are all progressing toward supreme, right and full awakening; they are each irreversible from awakening. If he should kill these Bodhisattvas, the fault—the obstacle caused by the deed—would cause him to burn in the great hells for as long as it take each one of these Bodhisattva to achieve supreme, right and full awakening, consecutively. Therefore, Captain, think of some skill in means to prevent this person from killing the five hundred merchants and going to the great hells because of the deed.’

    “Son of the family: Then the captain Great Compassionate awoke. He considered what means there might be to prevent that person from killing the five hundred merchants and going to the great hells. Seven days passed with a wind averse to sailing to Jambu Continent. Without wind during those seven days he plunged deep into thought, not speaking to anyone. “He thought, ‘There is no means to prevent this from slaying the merchants and going to the great hells but to kill him.’ “And he thought, ‘if I were to report this to the merchants, they would kill and slay him with angry thoughts and all go to the great hells themselves.’ “And he thought, ‘if I were to kill this person, I would likewise burn in the great hells for one hundred-thousand eons because of it. Yet I can bear to experience the pain of the great hells, that this person not slay these five hundred merchants and develop so much evil karma. I will kill this person myself.

    “Son of the family: Accordingly, the captain Great Compassionate protected those five hundred merchants and protected that person from going to the great hells, by deliberately stabbing and slaying that person who was a robber with a spear, with great compassion and skill in means. And all among the company achieved their aims and each went to his own city. Son of the family. At that time, in that life I was none other than the Captain Great Compassionate. Have no second thought or doubt on this point. The five hundred merchants on board the five hundred Bodhisattvas who are to niranize to supreme, right and full awakening in this auspicious eon.

    “Son of the family: For me, Samsara was curtailed for one hundred-thousand eons because of that skill in means and great compassion. And the robber died to be reborn in a world of paradise. The five hundred merchants on board are the hundred future Buddhas of the auspicious eon. Son of the family, what do you think of this? Can curtailing birth and death for one hundred-thousand eons with that skill in means and that great compassion with gnosis of skill in means be regarded as the Bodhisattva’s obstacle caused by past deeds? Do not view it in that way. That should be regarded as his very skill in means.”



Of course Atma got soon killed following the compassionate words of the top heroes and Bodhisattvas:

Quote from: Bodhisattva Zrxn
May the Light of Mahayana shine upon you and may you one day awaken bodhicitta and see that you are walking the Bodhisattva path. (Bodhisattva Zrxn)
 

Quote from: ??
Nagarjuna:

    O sublime, precious bodhicitta,

    May it arise in those in whom it has not arisen.

    May it never decline where it has arisen,

    But go on increasing further and further



On stealing from Buddha, Dhamma Sangha:

[–]clickstation

http://accesstoinsight.org :)

(Or to be more precise http://www.accesstoinsight.org/tipitaka/index.html)


[–]Samana_Johann

Such is give, do never buy Dhamma or even steal, debbxi! Only in that way you could benefit. By intention, words and deeds.




[–]clickstationchan

To be fair, translators and publishers gotta eat, too.


[–]Samana_Johann

Foolish thought, to be straight forward. Not even the requirement to teach and actually (let me bet) you have never given food to any monk, have you ever given something?

Dhamma is not able to be carried by laypeople. That is impossible, and actually there is more destroyed as gained.

Maybe you like to start to learn about economy of gifts

A monk (a person) is not worthy of what he gives you back, such would stay in the world. That is because you have been introduced by dealers into the teachings, and as they deal (making a livelihood on Dhamma selling, monks as lay people), how could they teach different and just like the Buddha taught. If you are more a Tibetan, study the Bodhisattva vows and what it would cause to earn money in the name of the Buddha, Dhamma, Sangha.


   
One should not make an effort everywhere, should not be another's hireling, should not live dependent on another, should not go about as a trader in the Dhamma. Paṭisalla Sutta


There is no way to gain any from a buy of a Dhamma book, you might have entertainment, but you even increase "I can" and I am independent and wrong view. If we talk about the buyer.

Somebody who sells the Dhamma, is really a poor person. You can be sure, he will never have a happy life at the end. Its not possible to be the great giver, if living on the first floor. That is why Sila has much more value in this case. No need to give if not possible.

Atma gives it 10 year, if there is no change, and the Sangha is gone from this world. Never see it again for the most.

You will not easily get such straight forward words, so think about it. Its not for a bad.


[–]clickstation

Honestly, and no offense, I'm having a tough time understanding what you mean.

But one thing is clear: I'm not disparaging monks in any way. I'm just saying that "buying Dhamma" isn't always a bad thing, especially if it's simply a translation, where the translator's "Dhamma level" doesn't factor too much into it.

And I certainly can't agree that one can't benefit from the Dhamma if it's "bought."


[–]debbxi

...yea... and I wouldn't know how else to receive it at this point.


[–]Samana_Johann

Don't worry, Atma did not feel you offend consciously (but unknowingly, which is actually more dangerous, its not so that one knows without having be taught aside of some seldom Paccecabuddhas this days in this world, and they are not able to teach.) all, Mr/Mrs Clickstation.

    I'm just saying that "buying Dhamma" isn't always a bad thing, especially if it's simply a translation, where the translator's "Dhamma level" doesn't factor too much into it.

Its the fist time in 2500 years that Dhamma is sold. It is always a bad thing, not knowing is also akusala. That why you are taught, to make not the same mistake. Live your live and if you are inspired to give, give. If not not, not. No need to sell something what is not ones own. An Arahat would have the right, but he do it neither. That is Osho-Dhamma, what you costumers get served. Buddhas economy is beyond the world and there is no way to really misuse it without earning the fruits, sooner or later.

So when ever you enter, think about what you can give, not vici versa.


[–]clickstation

Well, I understand you better now, and you hold a good point.

Still, in my opinion, that's the ideal.. but not the bare minimum :)

Let's agree to disagree.


[–]clickstation

Well, I understand you better now, and you hold a good point.

Still, in my opinion, that's the ideal.. but not the bare minimum :)

Let's agree to disagree.



[–]Samana_Johann

No problem, Dhukka is "just", no need to go to a judge to come to the Buddha at least if came in contact one time.


[–]Fire_Elemental - vajrayana
   
If you are more a Tibetan, study the Bodhisattva vows and what it would cause to earn money in the name of the Buddha, Dhamma, Sangha.


Please don't disparage other Buddhist vehicles, schools, teachers, etc. here are /r/Buddhism.


[–]Samana_Johann

Who tells? Avannaraha Sutta: Dispraise . So is it yours? Better train your Bodhisattva Vows.

If that is not right, read and learn. First the shared Sutta. And then Root Bodhisattva Vows - A root downfall means a loss of the entire set of bodhisattva vows.

(2) Not sharing Dharma teachings or wealth# (3) Not listening to others' apologies or striking others (5) Taking offerings intended for the Triple Gem (6) Forsaking the holy Dharma (12) Turning others away from full enlightenment (13) Turning others away from their pratimoksha vows (we had even the mordering Boddhisattva this days...) (16) Accepting what has been stolen from the Triple Gem (17) Establishing unfair policies

And such is the most dangers, thinking on Buddhamind... (8) Committing any of the five heinous crimes

Very important and nobody cares! (11) Teaching voidness to those whose minds are untrained

These are your vows. The Buddha did not give such to laypeople, since they are not capable.

And who would you even know if not here or there a Bodhisattva is talking to you?

Vajarana is known to handle and sell the most of the Dhamma and make Business, live in dependency of a certain group. Not possible.

So we are right on the topic, and it is in regard of Buddha-Dhamma or is it a Tibetan forum?

Its absolutely good and proper if you see that as a heavy rebuke.


[–]Samana_Johann

...To continue maintaining and expanding our website requires 100,000 euros (US $150,000) a year. Berzin Archiv.

They do not really know what they vow, and think that a person, who have even not learned to great can be a Bodhisattva, you are cheating people and life from it, that's it. Classical Pyramid-business.




[–]Fire_Elemental vajrayana

/u/Samana_Johann, I did not post to open a conversation with you, I posted, as a moderator, to tell you the minimum standard of conduct to post on this board. If you continue to sow discord you will be banned. This is your last warning.



So such is neither Mahayana nor Bodhisattva Path, that is simply foolishness.
« Last Edit: June 24, 2015, 06:42:36 AM by Johann »
This post and Content has come to be by Dhamma-Dana and so is given as it       Dhamma-Dana: Johann

Offline Johann

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Aramika   *

Ein oder mehrer Beiträge wurden hier im Thema abgeschnitten und damit in neues Thema "Karma Yeshe Rabgye, helps you to kill your mammy and daddy! 100% Compassionated! " eröffnet. Bitte scheuen Sie nicht davor zurück, etwaigen Rat oder Kritik dazu mitzuteilen.  Viel Freude und Inspiration auch im neuen Thema. Anumodana!

One or more posts have been cut out of this topic here. A new topic, based on it, has been created as "Karma Yeshe Rabgye, helps you to kill your mammy and daddy! 100% Compassionated! " . Please do not hesitate to claim or give supporting hints.  Much joy and inspiration also in the new Topic. Anumodana!
This post and Content has come to be by Dhamma-Dana and so is given as it       Dhamma-Dana: Johann

Tags:
 

Plauderbox

 

Johann

May 22, 2018, 10:11:37 AM
Sadhu!
 

Marcel

May 22, 2018, 09:37:30 AM
 :-* :-* :-*
einen verdienstvollen uposatha wünsche ich allen  :-* :-* :-*
 

Marcel

May 19, 2018, 03:07:57 PM
 :-* :-* :-*

ehrwürdiger bhante

 :-* :-* :-*
 

Johann

May 19, 2018, 03:05:38 PM
Nyom Marcel.
 

Johann

May 14, 2018, 01:24:42 PM
Sadhu!
 

Marcel

May 14, 2018, 01:23:37 PM
 :-* :-* :-*
allen ein verdienstvollen uposatha

 :-* :-* :-*
 

Johann

May 14, 2018, 08:34:09 AM
Schüsse von Wilderern am Tag sind ja nicht ungewöhnlich, doch aus mehreren Richtungen und automatischen Waffen doch bisher hier nicht üblich gewesen. Möge niemand anderen Schaden zufügen und sich mit Abstehen davon jeder beschützen.
 

Johann

May 14, 2018, 01:06:38 AM
It's not an accident that you came here and it will be not an accident whether one stays, comes back or leaves for another becoming or goes beyond.
 

Johann

May 13, 2018, 06:51:53 AM
Mag da keiner seine Mutter an dem Tag vergessen zu ehren.
 

Johann

May 11, 2018, 02:11:37 PM
Nyom Marcel.

Schlangentag und -nacht heute. Wem mag man was vergönnen? Der Schlange? Den Mäusen? Metta & Samvega oder umgekehrt? Mal angstlos Hunger, mal Angst, mal Maus, mal Schlange, essen, gegessen, verfolgen, gejagt...
 

Marcel

May 11, 2018, 11:57:36 AM
 :-* :-* :-*
ehrwürdiger bhante
 :-* :-* :-*
 

Johann

May 10, 2018, 04:00:02 PM
Nyom Marcel.
 

Marcel

May 09, 2018, 03:08:42 PM
 :-* :-* :-*
 

Johann

May 09, 2018, 07:01:42 AM
Nyom Matthew.
 

Johann

May 06, 2018, 11:49:06 PM
Chamreoun bo, Moritz
 

Moritz

May 06, 2018, 05:12:29 AM
Vandami Bhante _/\_
Einen angenehmen Tag. _/\_
 

Johann

May 04, 2018, 12:18:14 PM
...And what is lack of food for the arising of unarisen sloth & drowsiness, or for the growth & increase of sloth & drowsiness once it has arisen? There is the potential for effort, the potential for exertion, the potential for striving. To foster appropriate attention to them: This is lack
 

Johann

May 04, 2018, 12:14:44 PM
...“Und was ist das Fehlen von Nahrung für unaufgekommene Faulheit und Trägheit, oder für das Wachsen und Mehren von Faulheit unf Trägheit, wenn einmal aufgekommen? Da ist das Vermögen für Anstrengung, das Vermögen für Ausübung, das Vermögen für Streben. Dafür passende Aufmerk
 

Sophorn

April 30, 2018, 02:59:48 AM
Sadhu.  :-* :-* :-*
 

Johann

April 30, 2018, 01:04:45 AM
Ein hingabevolles Visakha-Fest, allen die es heute begehen, oder nochmal.


A devoted Visakha-fest for all who conduct it today, or again.[/en]
 

Johann

April 29, 2018, 08:42:23 AM
Sadhu!
 

Sophorn

April 29, 2018, 05:54:57 AM
Viel Segen und Einsicht heute an Vesakh Bochea!  :-* :-* :-*
 

Johann

April 29, 2018, 02:08:23 AM
Heute oder morgen gedenkt und erfreut man sich an Buddhas Geburt, Erwachen und letztes Dahinscheinden.

_/\_

- Namo tassa bhagavato arahato sammā-sambuddhassa -
 

Marcel

April 28, 2018, 02:58:36 PM
 :-* Ehrwürdiger Bhante  :-*
 

Johann

April 28, 2018, 02:55:18 PM
Nyom Marcel.
 

Johann

April 28, 2018, 12:44:32 PM
Geizhals :) (und nach dem Dhamma gegeben, wird so und so nichts angenommen.

Sadhu! Und mudita!

Nyom Moritz.

Visitor

April 28, 2018, 10:27:19 AM
Möge es euch allen gut gehen! Danke für Alles. Ich bin für ewig verschuldet. Komme zurück wenn ich was zu geben habe.
 

Moritz

April 28, 2018, 07:48:45 AM
Vandami, Bhante _/\_
 

Marcel

April 25, 2018, 02:20:08 PM
 :-* sadhu, möge es dem ehrwürdigen bhante johann schnell wieder bessergehen :-*
 

Johann

April 25, 2018, 02:09:45 PM
Körper. Besser, Atma würde vor einigen Tagen mit medizin versorgt und be-iniziert. Ein paar Tage noch bis NW der Med. wohl weg ist.
 

Marcel

April 25, 2018, 02:02:51 PM
 :-* :-* :-*
 

Johann

April 25, 2018, 02:00:11 PM
Atma ist/übt am Samma-vayamieren/-mimieren. Fegen, sozusagen.
 

Marcel

April 25, 2018, 01:58:03 PM
 :-* anumodana ehrwürdiger bhante johann ich werder darauf achten :-* wie geht es ihnen mit der malaria-erkankung?  :-*
 

Johann

April 25, 2018, 01:52:35 PM
Na gerade auf guten Zuständen SOLLTE man, zum Zwecke der wahren Sicherheit aufbauen, sie entwickeln und festigen, Nyom Marcel.
 

Marcel

April 25, 2018, 01:37:13 PM
 :-* "im moment" geht es mir gut! aber da kann ich wirklich nicht drauf bauen :-* wie ist das wohlbefinden des ehrwürdigen bhante Johann?  :-*
 

Johann

April 25, 2018, 01:25:09 PM
Wie geht es Nyom Marcel?
 

Marcel

April 25, 2018, 01:12:57 PM
 :-* ehrwürdiger bhante johann  :-*
 

Johann

April 25, 2018, 01:11:36 PM
Nyom Marcel
 

Johann

April 22, 2018, 09:11:17 AM
Sadhu!
 

Sophorn

April 22, 2018, 08:40:14 AM
 :-* :-* :-*
May every being be happy and free from dukkha.
May many renew their vows in silas today.   :-* :-* :-*
 

Danilo

April 15, 2018, 12:43:25 AM
Bhante _/\_
 

Johann

April 15, 2018, 12:38:56 AM
Nyom Danilo.
 

Johann

April 12, 2018, 10:05:15 AM
Moritz
 

Moritz

April 12, 2018, 08:34:11 AM
Namasakara, Bhante. _/\_
 

Moritz

April 10, 2018, 07:19:18 PM
Hello.
 

Johann

April 10, 2018, 01:09:20 PM
Nyom. (Sideboad ist stets zugeklappt... tech. Probl.) 3:00 ist auch schon guten Tag.
 

Moritz

April 10, 2018, 03:06:49 AM
Good day (night here)
_/\_
 

Moritz

April 10, 2018, 02:54:42 AM
Namasakara, Bhante. _/\_
 

Johann

April 09, 2018, 09:43:17 AM
Take your time Nyom Danilo and watch the breath to stay best calm for best benefit. A lot of chances to get ride of many ols burdens.
 

Danilo

April 08, 2018, 06:24:57 PM
_/\_

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