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Author Topic: [English/D] Fear of others - Thanissaro Bhikkhu  (Read 4269 times)

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Offline Johann

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[English/D] Fear of others - Thanissaro Bhikkhu
« on: March 01, 2013, 02:33:21 AM »
Dhammatalk

Fear of others
by Bhikkhu Thanissaro (April 2011)
~ 10min






Download:
http://sangham.net/index.php?action=tpmod;dl=item40
« Last Edit: October 01, 2014, 01:27:03 PM by Johann »
This post and Content has come to be by Dhamma-Dana and so is given as it       Dhamma-Dana: Johann

Offline turtle

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Re: Fear of others - Thanissaro Bhikkhu
« Reply #1 on: April 20, 2014, 08:01:44 PM »
I have prepared a transcript:

- - -

Fear of Others

April 12, 2011

Years back, a woman brought a friend of hers to meditate here. The friend had never meditated before. And at the end of the hour, she turned to the woman who brought her here and said, »I've never suffered so much in my life.«  Which just goes to show that the mind can create a lot of suffering for itself. In fact, as the Buddha pointed out, it's the suffering we create for ourselves that really weighs down the mind, much more than the suffering that comes from outside, the sights, sounds, smells, tastes, tactile sensations from other people. And the fears we have are often misdirected. The Buddha never says that fear is in and of itself unskillful. Many times, I've had some psychotherapists ask me about this, »Why doesn't the Buddha list fear as one of the roots for unskillful behavior?« And it's because  there are some things that are actually worthy of fear. The fear becomes unskillful when it's tied up in greed, aversion, delusion. And that's the kind of fear you want to get past. The fear that comes from knowing that your mind has unskillful habits, and that conditions could come about where those unskillful habits take over: that's something to be feared.

You want to train your mind so that it is not influenced into doing unskillful things by any kind of conditions. And until the mind has reached that point, you've got something to fear. So the important thing as we practice is learning which fears are useless, and which fears are useful.

Particularly fears of other people's opinions. Other people can hurt you, yes. And we see so much of it in the world, people are harming one another all the time. But you can't let that potential dissuade you from doing what you know is right. That kind of fear, the Buddha says, is a cause of what they call »agati,« something that takes you off course. There are four kinds of agati altogether. You go off course because of things you desire, you want a reward of some kind from somebody, or you want a certain kind of pleasure that you think is going to come from doing something that is unskillful, so that desire pulls you off. Then there's agati that comes from aversion. When you're not willing to do something simply because you just don't like it, even though it may be the right thing to do, you don't like it, and that gets in the way. There's agati that comes from delusion, when you simply don't know what's the right and the wrong way to do. And finally, there's agati that comes from fear.

These are all biases, and the word agati basically means »that takes you to a bad destination, takes you off course.« So you have to look at the fears that take you off course. The fears that someone will not like you or someone will punish you for doing something that you know is right, or that someone will create difficulties for you. You have to learn to be impervious to that. The fact that some people may not like you – well, as Ajahn Fuang once said, it's the people who like you that you are most beholden to. As he once said, if people hate you, then you can come and go as you like, you don't have to ask their permission, you don't have to be worried about what they're going to do while you're away. So there are times when you know the right thing to do is going to displease other people and there's no way around it. You have to be willing to put up with that, put up with their displeasure. If there are ways that you can smoothe things over, so much the better. But there come times when you can't. We have to stand up for what's right. And in that case, you can't let conflict or the fear of conflict dissuade you. I think I told you about the time when I gave my first Dharma talk. Ajahn Fuang said, »Imagine that you have a sword in your hand. Anybody out there in the audience who doesn't like what you have to say, you just cut off their head.« It's a shocking image, but it was effective. It made me reflect back on how much my own fears were actually the problem. Who knows what those other people were thinking? But it was my anticipation that they might not like it, or that they might disapprove, or that they may look down on me, or whatever, that was getting in the way. And that kind of fear is an agati: something that pulls you off course. If people are kind enough to tell you that you've done something wrong, or even if they let you know in not such a kind way that you've done something wrong, at least then you can look at it and see: well, was that wrong or was that not.

But these floating nameless fears that they just may not like you, or they may do something confrontational: you have to realize you're hobbling yourself with those fears. And those are the kind of fears you want to get over. You have to learn how to look past them. Well, what exactly would be so horrible about their disliking you, or their looking down on you? Which part of the mind is injured? Well, learn how not to identify with that part of the mind. Which part of the mind feels threatened? Again, learn how not to identify with it. That's the Buddha's prime tactic in learning how not to suffer: anything that is subject to harm leaves you open to danger, leaves you open to suffering. Why identify with it? And if you can think in this way, you can find yourself shedding all kinds of unskillful forms of pride, and the pride that masks as an extreme shame. A lot of unskillful things hide around these things that we're afraid of. These things where we feel threatened. And so it's good to look into those.

This is why we meditate: to give ourselves a good, solid position inside so we can look at these other things that we've identified with for so long, habits, fears, the things that can pull us off course. All four of these things are desires that are unskillful, our aversions, our delusions, our unskillful fears. So this is where the real dangers lie: these habits we have. These are the real things that you should fear, and fortunately, there's something you can do about them, you're not stuck with them. You've been carrying them around, but you don't have to keep carrying them around.

 Sometimes, it takes time to learn how to let go and to live with the fact that there are people out there who will never like you no matter what, no matter how well you behave, no matter how intelligent you are, no matter how much you do for the world, there are going to be people who dislike you for some reason, some old karmic thing, or they themselves don't like living in the world where they feel threatened by someone else doing better that they did. So there are all kinds of reasons that people would decide that they would dislike you or wish you harm. You can't let that stop you. The Buddha himself was cursed by people. As Ajahn Lee once said, the people can curse you and their mouths can open a whole yard, but they never actually reach you. You're the one who is pulling in their criticism. And that refers to the words they actually say to you. And here we are afraid of what people will think! We are the ones who are stabbing ourselves with this. So that's the habit you want to fear, and that's the habit you can learn to let go of. And fortunately, because it is something that you are doing yourself, you also have the power not to do it. So try to sort through your fears and see which ones are actually useful and which ones are hobbling you from doing the skillful thing. And to realize you're hobbling yourself, you can take off those shackles and walk with a lighter step.

- - -

Corrections welcome, esp. about the last sentence.

Offline Moritz

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Re: Fear of others - Thanissaro Bhikkhu
« Reply #2 on: May 04, 2014, 09:53:57 PM »
Corrections:
Quote
You go off course because of things you desire, you want a reward of some kind from somebody, or you want a certain kind of pleasure that you think is going to come from doing something that is unskillful, so that desire pulls you off. Then there's agati that comes from aversion. When you're not willing to do something simply because you just don't like it, even though it may be the right thing to do, you don't like it, and that gets in the way. There's agati that comes from delusion, when you simply don't know what's the right and the wrong thing to do. And finally, there's agati that comes from fear.

...

But these floating nameless fears that they just may not like you, or they may do something that is confrontational:

...

And if you can think in this way, you can you'll find yourself shedding all kinds of unskillful forms of pride, and the pride that masks as an extreme shame.

...

Sometimes it takes time to learn how to let go and to live with the fact that there are people out there who will never like you no matter what, no matter how well you behave, no matter how intelligent you are, no matter how much you do for the world, there are going to be people who dislike you for some reason, some old karmic thing, or they themselves don't like living in the world where they feel threatened by someone else doing better that than they did. So there are all kinds of reasons that people would decide that they would dislike you or wish you harm. You can't let that stop you. The Buddha himself was cursed by people. As Ajahn Lee once said, the people can curse you and their mouths can open a whole yard, but they never actually reach you. You're the one who is pulling in their criticism. And that refers to the words they actually say to you. And here we are afraid of what other people will think! We are the ones who are stabbing ourselves with this. So that's the habit you want to fear, and that's the habit you can learn to let go of. And fortunately, because it is something that you are doing yourself, you also have the power not to do it. So try to sort through your fears and see which ones are actually useful and which ones are hobbling you from doing the skillful thing. And to realize that you're hobbling yourself. You can take off those shackles and walk with a lighter step.



Corrected version:

Quote
Fear of Others

April 12, 2011

Years back, a woman brought a friend of hers to meditate here. The friend had never meditated before. And at the end of the hour, she turned to the woman who brought her here and said, »I've never suffered so much in my life.«  Which just goes to show that the mind can create a lot of suffering for itself. In fact, as the Buddha pointed out, it's the suffering we create for ourselves that really weighs down the mind, much more than the suffering that comes from outside, the sights, sounds, smells, tastes, tactile sensations from other people. And the fears we have are often misdirected. The Buddha never says that fear is in and of itself unskillful. Many times, I've had some psychotherapists ask me about this, »Why doesn't the Buddha list fear as one of the roots for unskillful behavior?« And it's because  there are some things that are actually worthy of fear. The fear becomes unskillful when it's tied up in greed, aversion, delusion. And that's the kind of fear you want to get past. The fear that comes from knowing that your mind has unskillful habits, and that conditions could come about where those unskillful habits take over: that's something to be feared.

You want to train your mind so that it is not influenced into doing unskillful things by any kind of conditions. And until the mind has reached that point, you've got something to fear. So the important thing as we practice is learning which fears are useless, and which fears are useful.

Particularly fears of other people's opinions. Other people can hurt you, yes. And we see so much of it in the world, people are harming one another all the time. But you can't let that potential dissuade you from doing what you know is right. That kind of fear, the Buddha says, is a cause of what they call »agati,« something that takes you off course. There are four kinds of agati altogether. You go off course because of things you desire, you want a reward of some kind from somebody, or you want a certain kind of pleasure that you think is going to come from doing something unskillful, so that desire pulls you off. Then there's agati that comes from aversion. When you're not willing to do something simply because you just don't like it, even though it may be the right thing to do, you don't like it, and that gets in the way. There's agati that comes from delusion, when you simply don't know what's the right and the wrong thing to do. And finally, there's agati that comes from fear.

These are all biases, and the word agati basically means »that takes you to a bad destination, takes you off course.« So you have to look at the fears that take you off course. The fears that someone will not like you or someone will punish you for doing something that you know is right, or that someone will create difficulties for you. You have to learn to be impervious to that. The fact that some people may not like you – well, as Ajahn Fuang once said, it's the people who like you that you are most beholden to. As he once said, if people hate you, then you can come and go as you like, you don't have to ask their permission, you don't have to be worried about what they're going to do while you're away. So there are times when you know the right thing to do is going to displease other people and there's no way around it. You have to be willing to put up with that, put up with their displeasure. If there are ways that you can smoothe things over, so much the better. But there come times when you can't. We have to stand up for what's right. And in that case, you can't let conflict or the fear of conflict dissuade you. I think I told you about the time when I gave my first Dharma talk. Ajahn Fuang said, »Imagine that you have a sword in your hand. Anybody out there in the audience who doesn't like what you have to say, you just cut off their head.« It's a shocking image, but it was effective. It made me reflect back on how much my own fears were actually the problem. Who knows what those other people were thinking? But it was my anticipation that they might not like it, or that they might disapprove, or that they may look down on me, or whatever, that was getting in the way. And that kind of fear is an agati: something that pulls you off course. If people are kind enough to tell you that you've done something wrong, or even if they let you know in not such a kind way that you've done something wrong, at least then you can look at it and see: well, was that wrong or was that not.

But these floating nameless fears that they just may not like you, or they may do something that is confrontational: you have to realize you're hobbling yourself with those fears. And those are the kind of fears you want to get over. You have to learn how to look past them. Well, what exactly would be so horrible about their disliking you, or their looking down on you? Which part of the mind is injured? Well, learn how not to identify with that part of the mind. Which part of the mind feels threatened? Again, learn how not to identify with it. That's the Buddha's prime tactic in learning how not to suffer: anything that is subject to harm leaves you open to danger, leaves you open to suffering. Why identify with it? And if you can think in this way, you'll find yourself shedding all kinds of unskillful forms of pride, and the pride that masks as an extreme shame. A lot of unskillful things hide around these things that we're afraid of. These things where we feel threatened. And so it's good to look into those.

This is why we meditate: to give ourselves a good, solid position inside so we can look at these other things that we've identified with for so long, habits, fears, the things that can pull us off course. All four of these things are desires that are unskillful, our aversions, our delusions, our unskillful fears. So this is where the real dangers lie: these habits we have. These are the real things that you should fear, and fortunately, there's something you can do about them, you're not stuck with them. You've been carrying them around, but you don't have to keep carrying them around.

 Sometimes it takes time to learn how to let go and to live with the fact that there are people out there who will never like you no matter what, no matter how well you behave, no matter how intelligent you are, no matter how much you do for the world, there are going to be people who dislike you for some reason, some old karmic thing, or they themselves don't like living in the world where they feel threatened by someone else doing better than they did. So there are all kinds of reasons that people would decide that they would dislike you or wish you harm. You can't let that stop you. The Buddha himself was cursed by people. As Ajahn Lee once said, people can curse you and their mouths can open a whole yard, but they never actually reach you. You're the one who is pulling in their criticism. And that refers to the words they actually say to you. And here we are afraid of what other people will think! We are the ones who are stabbing ourselves with this. So that's the habit you want to fear, and that's the habit you can learn to let go of. And fortunately, because it is something you are doing yourself, you also have the power not to do it. So try to sort through your fears and see which ones are actually useful and which ones are hobbling you from doing the skillful thing. And to realize that you're hobbling yourself. You can take off those shackles and walk with a lighter step.


Translation:

Quote
Angst vor anderen

Vor Jahren brachte eine Frau eine ihrer Freundinnen mit, um hier zu meditieren. Die Freudin hatte niemals zuvor meditiert. Am Ende der Stunde drehte sie sich zu der Frau um, die sie her gebracht hatte und sagte: "Ich habe niemals zuvor in meinem Leben so viel gelitten." Was bloß verdeutlicht, dass der Geist viel Leid für sich selbst erzeugen kann. In der Tat ist es, wie der Buddha aufzeigte, das Leiden, das wir für uns selbst schaffen, das wirklich unseren Geist nach unten drückt, viel mehr als das Leiden, das von Außen kommt, die Anblicke, Klänge, Gerüche, Geschmäcker, taktilen Empfindungen von anderen Leuten. Und die Ängste, die wir haben, sind häufig fehlgesteuert. Der Buddha sagte niemals, dass Angst an und für sich selbst ungeschickt ist. Viele Male bin ich von einigen Psychotherapeuten hierüber gefragt worden: "Warum listet der Buddha nicht Angst als eine der Wurzeln für ungeschicktes Verhalten?" Und es ist, weil es einige Dinge gibt, die tatsächlich angemessen zu fürchten sind. Die Angst wird ungeschickt, wenn sie in Gier, Abneigung, Verblendung eingebunden ist. Und das ist die Art von Angst, die du überwinden willst. Die Angst, die daher kommt, dass du weißt, dass dein Geist ungeschickte Gewohnheiten hat, und dass Bedingungen aufkommen könnten, wo jene ungeschickten Gewohnheiten die Führung übernehmen: Das ist etwas, was zu fürchten ist.

Du willst deinen Geist so trainieren, dass er nicht durch irgendwelche Dinge dazu beeinflusst ist, ungeschickte Dinge zu tun. Und bis der Geist diesen Punkt erreicht hat, hast du etwas zu fürchten. Also ist das Wichtige, während wir praktizieren, zu lernen, welche Ängste nutzlos sind und welche Ängste nützlich sind.

Insbesondere Angst vor anderer Leute Meinungen. Andere Leute können dich verletzen, ja. Und wir sehen so viel davon in der Welt, Leute die einander verletzen, die ganze Zeit. Aber du hast dieses Potential dich nicht davon abbringen lassen, zu tun, wovon du weißt, dass es richtig ist. Diese Art von Angst, sagt der Buddha, ist eine Ursache dafür, was sie "agati" nennen, etwas, das dich vom Kurs abbringt. Es gibt im Ganzen vier Arten von agati. Du kommst vom Kurs ab wegen Dingen, die du begehrst, du möchtest eine Belohnung irgendwelcher Art von jemandem, oder du willst eine gewisse Art von Wohlgefühl haben, von dem du glaubst, dass es daher kommt, etwas Ungeschicktes zu tun, also reißt dich dieses Begehren weg. Dann ist da Begehren, das von Abneigung kommt. Wenn du nicht willens bist, etwas zu tun, einfach, weil du es nicht magst, selbst wenn es das Richtige sein mag, was zu tun ist, magst du es nicht. Und das kommt in den Weg. Dann ist da agati, das von Verblendung kommt, wenn du einfach nicht weißt, was das Richtige oder das Falsche zu tun wäre. Und schließlich ist da agati, das von Angst kommt.

Dies sind alle Voreingenommenheiten, und das Wort agati bedeutet im Grunde "das dich zu einem schlechten Bestimmungsort führt, dich vom Kurs abbringt." Also musst du dir die Ängste ansehen, die dich vom Kurs abbringen. Die Ängste, dass jemand dich nicht mögen wird oder jemand dich bestrafen wird, dafür, dass du etwas tust, von dem du weißt, dass es richtig ist, oder dass jemand Schwierigkeiten für dich schaffen wird. Du musst lernen, demgegenüber kugelsicher zu sein. Die Tatsache, dass manche Leute dich nicht mögen könnten – nun, wie Ajahn Fuang einmal sagte, du musst sie nicht nach Erlaubnis fragen, du brauchst dir keine Sorgen darüber zu machen, was sie tun werden, während du weg bist. Also sind da Zeiten, wenn du weißt, das Richtige, was zu tun ist, wird andere Leute unzufrieden machen, und es gibt keinen Weg drum herum. Du musst willens sein, damit zurecht zu kommen, ihre Unzufriedenheit in Kauf zu nehmen. Wenn da Wege sind, dass du die Dinge glätten kannst, um so besser. Aber es kommen Zeiten, wo du es nicht kannst. Wir müssen uns erheben für das, was richtig ist. Und in dem Fall kannst du Konflikt oder die Angst vor Konflikt dich nicht davon abbringen lassen. Ich denke, ich habe euch von der Zeit erzählt, wo ich meinen ersten Dhamma-Vortrag gab. Ajahn Fuang sagte: "Stelle dir vor, dass du ein Schwert in deiner Hand hältst. Jeder da draußen in der Zuhörerschaft, der nicht mag, was du zu sagen hast, hack ihnen einfach den Kopf ab." Es ist ein schockierendes Bild, aber es war effektiv. Es brachte mich zurück, darüber zu reflektieren, wie sehr meine eigenen Ängste eigentlich das Problem waren. Wer weiß, was diese anderen Leute dachten? Aber es war meine Erwartung, dass sie es nicht mögen könnten, oder dass sie es ablehnen könnten, oder dass sie auf mich herabsehen könnten, oder was auch immer, das in den Weg kam. Und diese Art von Angst ist ein agati: etwas, das einen vom Weg abbringt. Wenn Leute freundlich genug sind, dir zu sagen, dass du etwas falsch gemacht hast, oder selbst, wenn sie in einer nicht so freundlichen Weise sagen, dass du etwas Falsches getan hast, kannst du es dir zumindest anschauen und sehen: Gut, war das falsch oder war es das nicht?

Aber diese namenlosen Ängste, dass sie dich einfach nicht mögen könnten, oder dass sie etwas Konfrontierendes tun könnten: Du musst dir klar werden, dass du dich mit diesen Ängsten selbst hemmst. And das sind die Art von Ängsten, über die du hinaus kommen willst. Du musst lernen, wie du über sie hinweg kommst. Gut, was genau wäre so schrecklich daran, dass sie dich nicht mögen, oder dass sie auf dich herab blicken? Welcher Teil des Geistes ist verletzt? Gut, versuch dich nicht mit diesem Teil des Geistes zu identifizieren. Welcher Teil des Geistes fühlt sich bedroht? Wieder, lerne, dich nicht damit zu identifizieren. Das ist die vorrangige Taktik des Buddha im Lernen, nicht zu leiden: Alles, was verletzbar ist, lässt dich offen für Gefahr sein, lässt dich offen für Leid sein. Warum damit identifizieren? Und wenn du in dieser Weise denken kannst, wirst du dich alle ungeschickten Arten von Stolz ablegen finden, und den Stolz, der sich als eine extreme Scham maskiert. Viele ungeschickte Dinge verstecken sich um diese Dinge, vor denen wir Angst haben. Die Dinge, wo wir uns bedroht fühlen. Und so ist es gut, in diese hinein zu blicken.

Das ist, warum wir meditieren: um uns selbst eine gute, solide Position nach innen zu geben, so dass wir uns diese anderen Dinge ansehen können, mit denen wir uns so lange identifiziert haben, Gewohnheiten, Ängste, die Dinge, die dich vom Kurs abbringen können. Diese vier Dinge sind Begierden, die ungeschickt sind, unsere Abneigungen, unsere Verblendungen, unsere ungeschickten Ängste. Dies ist also, wo die realen Gefahren liegen: diese Gewohnheiten, die wir haben. Diese sind die realen Dinge, vor denen du dich fürchten solltest, und glücklicherweise gibt es etwas, was du gegen sie tun kannst, du sitzt nicht auf ihnen fest. Du trägst sie mit dir herum, aber du musst sie nicht mit dir herum tragen.

Manchmal braucht es Zeit, zu lernen, loszulassen und mit der Tatsache zu leben, dass es Leute da draußen geben wird, die dich niemals mögen werden, ganz gleich, was auch ist, egal, wie gut du dich verhältst, egal, wie intelligent du bist, egal wieviel du für die Welt tust, es werden Leute da sein, die dich aus irgendeinem Grund nicht mögen, irgendeine alte karmische Sache, oder sie selbst mögen es nicht, in einer Welt zu leben, wo sie sich bedroht fühlen von jemand anderem, der es besser tut als sie es getan haben. Also sind da alle Arten von Gründen, dass Leute entscheiden würden, dass sie dich nicht mögen oder dir Schaden wünschen. Du kannst dich davon nicht aufhalten lassen. Der Buddha selbst wurde von Leuten verflucht. Wie Ajahn Lee einmal sagte, Leute können dich verfluchen und ihre Münder können sich ein ganzes Zoll weit öffnen, aber sie erreichen dich niemals tatsächlich. Du bist derjenige, der ihre Kritik einsaugt. Und das bezieht sich auf die Worte, die sie tatsächlich zu dir sagen. Und hier sind wir, ängstlich, was andere Leute denken werden! Wir sind diejenigen, die uns damit erdolchen. Das also ist die Gewohnheit, vor der du Angst haben möchtest, und das ist die Gewohnheit, die du lernen kannst, loszulassen. Und glücklicherweise, weil es etwas ist, das du nicht selbst tust, hast du auch die Macht, es nicht zu tun. Also versuche, dich durch deine Ängste zu sortieren und zu sehen, welche tatsächlich nützlich sind und welche dich darin hemmen, das Geschickte zu tun. Und dir bewusst zu werden, dass du dich selbst hemmst. Du kannst diese Fesseln ablegen und leichteren Schrittes gehen.

_/\_

Offline Sophorn

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Re: Fear of others - Thanissaro Bhikkhu
« Reply #3 on: May 05, 2014, 01:27:52 AM »
 _/\_ _/\_ _/\_

Sadhu! Sadhu! Sadhu!

Möge euer Dana erhellen.

 _/\_ _/\_ _/\_

Offline Johann

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Re: Fear of others - Thanissaro Bhikkhu
« Reply #4 on: May 29, 2014, 06:47:21 AM »
Sadhu! Sadhu! Sadhu!
This post and Content has come to be by Dhamma-Dana and so is given as it       Dhamma-Dana: Johann

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Re: Fear of others - Thanissaro Bhikkhu
« Reply #5 on: August 25, 2014, 04:24:21 AM »
Unter der Annahme, dass Sie diese Arbeit auch gerne auf ZzE teilen, nehme ich es in die Liste der offenen Veröffentlichung auf.
Vielleicht noch gut die werte Frau Turtle zu fragen, ob es rechr ist und ob man Ihren Namen nennen, darf.
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Re: [English/D] Fear of others - Thanissaro Bhikkhu
« Reply #6 on: April 26, 2015, 08:04:40 AM »
Attma hat das Schweigen nach Nachfrage nicht weiter behandeln von Fr. Turtel als liegen gelassen des, bzw. Vergessen interpretiert und sich erlaubt dieses wenn nicht als anders gesehen (bitte jederzeit Bescheid geben), die Deutsche Übersetzung auf ZzE (Version von hier ) heute geteilt. (Einbindungen und Links folgen noch) und auch entsprechende otd und pdf Dateien zum herunterladen des Textes in Deutsch wurden ebenfalls erstellt und hochgeladen (odt als ev. Arbeitsdatei für zukünftige Nachbesserungen)

Angst vor anderen , auf accesstoinsight.eu (zugangzureinsicht.org) Anm. nicht auf ATI verfügbar, da neu.
« Last Edit: April 26, 2015, 08:14:59 AM by Johann »
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Re: [English/D] Fear of others - Thanissaro Bhikkhu
« Reply #7 on: April 28, 2015, 09:40:44 AM »
Zur Information
For information

Quote from: via email

-------- Forwarded Message --------
Subject:    Dhamma Dana gift "Fear of others"
Date:    Tue, 28 Apr 2015 14:06:55 +0700
From:    Johann Brucker <johann.brucker@sangham.net>
To:    Dhammatalks feedback <dhammatalks.feedback@gmail.com>


Dear Upasaka of the dhammatalks.org team,

Attma would like to share the final transcription of the Eveningtalk
which was generously given by a layperson in the Virtual Vihara
sangham.net [English/D] Fear of others - Thanissaro Bhikkhu
<http://sangham.net/index.php/topic,251.0.html>
and also a translation into German generously given our Aramika Moritz.
You will find the gift of Dhamma attached as pfd and an easy edit-able
otd File (word). You may delete the additional texts of origin and
donator if you wish, there is no claim to provide it further.

Here are also the links to the publications on accesstoinsight.eu

Angst vor anderen
<http://zugangzureinsicht.org/html/lib/authors/thanissaro/fearofothers.html>,
von Thanissaro Bhikkhu (2015; 3 S./7KB) Übersetzung von Laien für ZzE
[PDF icon]
<http://zugangzureinsicht.org/html/lib/authors/thanissaro/fearofothers.pdf>
[audio icon] <http://sangham.net/index.php?action=tpmod;dl=item40>
    Diese kurze Dhammalehrrede soll einen Eindruck darüber geben, wie
    unsere unheilsamen Ängste oft selbst gemacht sind, und
    Voreingenommenheiten oft unseren Geist einnehmen. Wie immer wird
    hier auch die Verbindung zum Pfad und Training im Dhamma aufgezeigt,
    und wie wir das Problem auf diesem lösen. Diese Lehrrede stammt aus
    der Sammlung der Morgen- und Abend-Lehrreden, gehalten im Kloster
    Metta, und wurde ursprünglich vom auf dhammatalks.org
    <http://dhammatalks.org> geteilt.


Fear of others
<http://zugangzureinsicht.org/html/lib/authors/thanissaro/fearofothers_en.html>,
by Thanissaro Bhikkhu (2003; 3pp./7KB) , transcribed by lay people for
ZzE [PDF icon]
<http://zugangzureinsicht.org/html/lib/authors/thanissaro/fearofothers_en.pdf>
[audio icon] <http://sangham.net/index.php?action=tpmod;dl=item40>
    This short Dhamma talk should give a small impression, how fear in
    daily live is actually self made and how preoccupations can
    determine our mind. The way to the path and the training according
    the Dhamma of the Buddha is pointed out as well, as how could one
    overcome this problem. This transcript origins from a collection of
    morning and evening talks and was shared on dhammatalks.org
    <http://dhammatalks.org>.

Attma (I) beg for not using the copyrights as mentioned on you pages as
they are not increasing right view but merely lead to wrong view. There
are gifts and sacrifices (as it is mentioned in AN 10.176):

      'He has right view
    <http://zugangzureinsicht.org/html/ptf/dhamma/sacca/sacca4/samma-ditthi/index_en.html>
    and is not warped in the way he sees things: 'There is what is given
    <http://zugangzureinsicht.org/html/ptf/dhamma/dana/index_en.html>,
    what is offered, what is sacrificed. There are fruits & results of
    good & bad actions
    <http://zugangzureinsicht.org/html/ptf/dhamma/sacca/sacca4/samma-ditthi/kamma_en.html>.
    There is this world & the next world. There is mother & father.
    There are spontaneously reborn beings; there are brahmans &
    contemplatives who, faring rightly & practicing rightly, proclaim
    this world & the next after having directly known & realized it for
    themselves.'

People of right views are claiming rights, they take what they feel that
is right and dont wait what is given or even give. That does not mean,
that a person with right view would not understand, but the person with
wrong view would think that he has the inherent right. So if it is good
for you Attma would use the text as we used to use on accesstoinsight.eu
an modified text as valued Mr. Bullitt used also for additional gifts:

    *Provenance:*
    [dana/©]2011-2015 Thanissaro Bhikkhu.
    Last Revision: sj, 12. April 2011.
    Generously provided by a devoted layperson (anonymously) who
    transcribed the talk spontaneously which was given by Ven.
    Thanissaro Bhikkhu at Metta Forest Monastery on 12. April. 2011 and
    was shared via dhammatalks.org <http://dhammatalks.org> as a gift of
    Dhamma.
    Eventually mistakes in the transcription, in translations,
    republishing, while editing, eventually misinterpretations and
    additions are in the sphere of responsibility of /Zugang zur Einsicht/.
    *Scope of this Dhamma-Gift:* You are invited to not only use this
    Dhamma-Gift here for yourself but also to share it, and your merits
    with it, again as a Dhamma gift and to copy, reformat, reprint,
    republish and redistribute this work in any medium whatsoever,
    provided that: (1) you only make such copies, etc. available /free
    of charge/; (2) you clearly indicate that any derivatives of this
    work (including translations) are derived from this source document;
    and (3) you include the full text of this "Scope of this
    Dhamma-Gift" in any copies or derivatives of this work. Anything
    beyond this can not be given here. For additional information about
    this gift, see the FAQ
    <http://zugangzureinsicht.org/html/faq_en.html#copyright>.
    *How to cite this document* (one suggested style): "Fears of
    others", by Thanissaro Bhikkhu. Transcribed from an audiofile,
    generosely transcribted by a devoted layperson and given for Zugang
    zur Einsicht, 26.April 2015,
    http://www.zugangzureinsicht.org/html/lib/authors/thanissaro/fearofothers_en.html,
    retrieved on: Tue Apr 28 2015 13:48:19 GMT+0700 (SE Asia Standard Time)
    Alternate format: [PDF icon]
    <http://zugangzureinsicht.org/html/lib/authors/thanissaro/cuttingpath_en.pdf>
    [audio icon] <http://sangham.net/index.php?action=tpmod;dl=item40>

The point: "(2) you clearly indicate that any derivatives of this work
(including translations) are derived from this source document" is realy
not needed by accesstoinsight.eu (zugangzureinsicht.org since there is
no claim for such, its taken from accesstoinsight.org and can be changes
if you wish.

The scope is actually the same like it is provided by you "copyright"
but the action has a different name and it is given and not taken at
least. So we would like to give the gift rather then to allow others to
take as they could think and develop the thought of "I have a (inherent)
right" as usual in countries where there is no more right view.

Attma request to do so in future.

As sangham.net has a plenty more to share and gift and desires to do so,
let Attma ask if we can do it in a way that does not take to much time
of yours, does not need additional work of yours and does not disturb
you to much. Attma thinks that he knows your "task" and sacrifice well
and its a pretty hard job. Please let me/us know.

It would be good if you accept this gift for the Sangha and their
further use and share


metta & mudita

Samana Johann

--
Please feel always welcome on sangham.net <http://sangham.net/> and to
discover the pages of Zugang zur Einsicht <http://zugangzureinsicht.org/>


This post and Content has come to be by Dhamma-Dana and so is given as it       Dhamma-Dana: Johann

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Johann

October 16, 2017, 05:40:03 PM
Sokh chomreoun, Nyom. (Mag sukha sich für Nyom mehren). Thoamada (Dhammada - naturly, gewohnt). At mean ay pisech te (nichts besonders). Klach dukkh, klach sokh (wohl und weh wechseln sich ab). Nyom sokh sabay dea te? Sokh leumom dea te?
 

Marcel

October 16, 2017, 04:13:43 PM
 :-* ehrwürdiger samana johann! wie ist ihr befinden?  :-*
 

Marcel

October 07, 2017, 01:56:00 PM
 :-* :-* :-*
 

Johann

October 07, 2017, 02:48:39 AM
Der Tathagata tut das, wenn man ihn in seinem Dhamma sieht, und dieser, entgegen Personen, kommt auf wenn man ihn nährt, und einmal da, geht er für einen nicht mehr verloren, bleibt Tor zur Todlosigkeit.
 

Marcel

October 06, 2017, 11:37:24 PM
 :-*
 

Marcel

October 06, 2017, 11:36:31 PM
 :-* ehrwürdiger samana johann :-* mögen sie noch lange leben,   für das wohl vieler.... anumodana, ich freue mich sehr! sie decken auf, was vorher verdeckt. so das vijja entstehen kann, und avijja gehen muss!! geht direkt ins herz!
 

Johann

October 06, 2017, 04:19:37 PM
Nyom Marcel.
 

Sophorn

September 28, 2017, 03:51:05 AM
 :-* :-* :-*
 

Johann

September 27, 2017, 12:17:53 PM
Nyom Sophorn, Roben mag man immer geben können. Im Monat nach dem Vassa Ende, ist es für jene Mönche, die den Vassa gehalten haben, möglich und einfacher für den Eigenbedarf Roben anzunehmen.
 

Sophorn

September 27, 2017, 07:01:23 AM
Bhante, ist dann die Robengabe möglich ab dem 5. Okt. bid zum nächsten Vollmond oder darf man auch danach Roben geben? :-*
 

Sophorn

September 27, 2017, 05:44:45 AM
Wie geht es Bhante heute? Haben die Tropfen geholfen?
 ::) :-*
 

Johann

September 05, 2017, 01:21:44 AM
Gerestet: funktioniert tadellos. Nochmal alle Zugangsdaten gemailt, Nyom.
 

Sophorn

September 04, 2017, 02:06:42 PM
Kana hat mit U. Chamroeun das Login mit neuem Passwort erfolglos versucht.
Daraufhin versuchten kana das über die Veränderung über E-mail, aber da erschien, dass die E-mailadresse nicht gültig war (die hatten Bhante auch an kana in der Mail bestätigt)
 :-* :-* :-*
 

Johann

September 04, 2017, 11:52:03 AM
Sollte email im Posteingang haben, Nyom Sophorn.
 

Johann

September 04, 2017, 11:41:14 AM
Kann nicht antworten auf was, Nyom Maria? Was und wo genauer?

Nyom Sophorn. Nyom Chomroeun kann kurzlich email Daten bekommen. Mal annehmend das PW auch vergessen, (abgesenhen von der Möglichkeit, link zu drücken wenn) wird Atma ein neues anlegen und ihm mailen.
 

Maria

September 04, 2017, 11:30:41 AM
 :-*
Werther Bhante , selbiges Problem was ich schon einmal hatte, Login geht aber kann nicht antworten, bin am Nachmittag bei neuen Computer, dieser hier ist schon über 12 Jahre alt.
 

Sophorn

September 04, 2017, 11:23:14 AM
Kana hat das File runtergeladen und U. Chamroeun gegeben,  der sich um die Kprrektur annehmen möchte. Kana wird auch gern das File den anderen Schülern zum Lesen teilen. Ev. sehen mehr Augen mehr.
 :-* :-* :-*
 

Sophorn

September 04, 2017, 11:17:06 AM
Verehrter Bhante, Chamroeun kann sich nicht einloggen. Ist das Passwort für E-mail oder sangham.net? In beiden Fällen haben kana das erfolglos probiert.
 :-* :-* :-*
 

Sophorn

September 04, 2017, 11:08:26 AM
 :-* :-* :-*
 

Johann

August 20, 2017, 01:37:40 AM
Es ist vielleicht gut eine Pause zu tun, doch kann es gut sein, daß man nicht zurückkehrt, für ein gutes oder schlechtes, für sich selbt und andere. Gut dort wo gut genährt und unterstützt und for allem Konzentration steigt, oder dort wo satt in jeder Hinsicht.
 

Johann

August 10, 2017, 11:31:40 AM
Wenn jemand Lust hat, oder anderen etwas Gutes oder Besseres tun kann und möchte: Korrekturlesen http://sangham.net/index.php/topic,1018.msg9625.html#msg9625 Baue nach und nach, so gut wie möglich ein auf ZzE.
 

Johann

August 07, 2017, 02:24:55 AM
Einen ausübungsreichen Vollmond-Uposatha and Gelegenheit die Mönche zu besuchen wünscht meine Person.
 

Sophorn

July 25, 2017, 03:59:03 PM
... versteht und womöglich sieht, wenn er nicht den Weg hierher
findet.

Großer Dank an alle im Hintergrund.

Mögen all diese Früchte vielfach zurückkommen und inspirieren.

Ayu vanno sukkham balam

 :-* :-* :-*
 

Sophorn

July 25, 2017, 03:55:25 PM
 :-* :-* :-*
karuna tvay bongkum Preah metschah

Herzliches Hallo an alle nach sehr langem!

Ein herzliches Dankeschön aus tiefsten Herzen an alle, die sich hier aktiv und indirekt hier beteiligen. Vor allem ein großes Sadhu an Bhante, der unvergleichliche Arbeit leistet, die kaum jemand ver
 

Johann

July 24, 2017, 03:15:56 AM
Fehlinvestition: Was immer man nicht in die Juwelen, in den Pfad investiert, ist vergeude Mühe, schnurrr einen fest im Rad des Leidens. Prüfen Sie es!   :) Wiederholungstäter...
 

Johann

July 17, 2017, 01:50:17 AM
Moritz
 

Moritz

July 16, 2017, 02:28:02 PM
Namasakara, Bhante _/\_
 

Johann

July 14, 2017, 07:07:17 AM
Moritz. Gut ihn früh Morgens und nicht bis in den frühen Morgen zu sehen.
 

Moritz

July 14, 2017, 07:03:53 AM
Namasakara, Bhante _/\_
 

Johann

July 13, 2017, 08:12:46 AM
Moritz.
 

Moritz

July 13, 2017, 07:42:39 AM
Chom reap lea
_/\_
 

Moritz

July 13, 2017, 07:40:46 AM
Namasakara, Bhante _/\_
 

Johann

July 08, 2017, 02:26:09 AM
Vor mehr als 2500 Jahen wurde a diesem Vollmondtag das Rad des Dhammas in bewegung gesetzt. Anumodana!
 

Mohan Gnanathilake

July 02, 2017, 08:24:13 AM
Sehr ehrwürdiger Samanera Johann,

ich bedanke mich bei Ihnen für Ihre nette Erklärung.

Dhamma Grüße an Sie aus Sri Lanka!

 

Johann

July 01, 2017, 07:43:41 PM
Nyom Mohan. Besser: "Ich hoffe, daß es Ihnen gut geht." und bestens (ohne suggerieren, wenn interessiert) "Wie geht es Ihnen." Oder: "Möge es Ihnen Gut gehen." (wenn metta ausdrücken wollend)
 

Mohan Gnanathilake

July 01, 2017, 10:43:15 AM
Sehr ehrwürdiger Samanera Johann,

ich glaube, dass es Ihnen gut geht.

Dhamma Grüße an Sie aus Sri Lanka!
 

Mohan Gnanathilake

July 01, 2017, 10:32:46 AM
Werter Micro,
herzliche Grüße aus Sri Lanka nach Deutschland!
 

Johann

July 01, 2017, 10:32:17 AM
Nyom Mohan.
 

Johann

June 25, 2017, 01:38:38 PM
Alles Zufälle. Nissaya. Und wenn da keine starke Grundlagenursache aufkommt, upanissayapaccayena, na dann war's das, und alles is weg. Lebewesen sind Erben ihrer Taten (im Geist, Wort und Körper).
 

Johann

June 25, 2017, 01:27:24 PM
Schwupps und weg. Waffen und Nahrung geholt.

Oh, was sag ich. Wenn man's doch nehmen kann, auch ohne das Gefühl zu nehmen... Unsinn hier. Hat doch keiner interesse Verdienste zu tun.
 

Johann

June 25, 2017, 01:21:28 PM
Mirco. Wie geht es?
 

Johann

June 25, 2017, 01:20:43 PM
Es ist doch viel angenehmer, wenn man sich nehmen kann was und wann immer man will, oder? Warum sollte man sich so viel antun, da sind genügend die Anbieten.
 

Johann

June 14, 2017, 06:45:07 PM
Jetzt aber vorerst. Möge jeder guten Unterhalt (ung) im Dhamma und Stärkung finden uud sich davon reichlich nehmen.
 

Mohan Gnanathilake

June 11, 2017, 08:24:45 AM
Werter Harry,

ich freue mich darüber, nach einigen Monaten wieder auf sangham.net Sie zu grüßen.

Herzliche Grüße aus Sri Lanka nach Deutschland!
 

Johann

June 09, 2017, 05:05:59 PM
Mögen sich alle, möge sich Guest der Uposatha-Einhaltung nicht nur heute annehmen, und glücksverheißende Zeit verbringen.

May all, may Guest not only today observe the Uposatha and spend auspicious time
 

Mohan Gnanathilake

June 03, 2017, 01:48:08 AM
Sehr ehrwürdiger Samanera Johann,

es geht mir zur Zeit gut. Ich glaube, dass es Ihnen auch gut geht.

Dhamma Grüße an Sie aus Sri Lanka!
 

Johann

June 02, 2017, 11:19:32 PM
Wie geht es Upasaka Mohan?
 

Mohan Gnanathilake

June 02, 2017, 10:51:50 PM
Wie sehr ehrwürdiger Samanera Johann geschrieben hat, hatte ich am 10. Mai 2017 meinen  Geburtstag, an dem Tag  in diesem Jahr das Wesakfest gefeiert wurde.
Beste Grüße an Sie aus Sri Lanka!
Mohan Barathi Gnanathilake
 

Johann

June 02, 2017, 12:33:54 PM
Wußte doch, daß so Nahrung immer gefressen werden will.  :)
"Sehr gut, weiter hungern."

Freut das Nyom Marcel wohlauf ist.
 

Marcel

June 02, 2017, 12:20:52 PM
weil "keines" immer noch die bezugnahme auf eines hat!

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