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2020 Feb 22 18:45:07
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2020 Feb 19 12:31:58
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2020 Feb 19 12:05:18
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2020 Feb 18 21:27:07
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2020 Feb 18 21:02:57
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2020 Feb 16 06:43:32
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2020 Feb 15 22:31:22
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2020 Feb 12 23:36:22
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2020 Feb 12 23:04:39
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2020 Feb 12 22:57:44
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2020 Feb 10 18:34:34
Johann: Nyom

2020 Feb 10 15:06:07
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2020 Feb 10 15:05:31
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2020 Feb 10 14:10:41
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2020 Feb 09 21:43:05
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2020 Feb 09 19:11:06
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2020 Feb 09 19:06:51
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2020 Feb 09 19:06:36
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2020 Feb 09 18:53:15
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2020 Feb 08 22:38:59
Johann: Wie immer zugeneigt, Nyom.

2020 Feb 08 17:21:10
Sophorn:  _/\_ Bhante, es lässt sich nicht hochladen. Kana macht das wie gehabt _/\_

2020 Feb 08 06:18:20
Johann: A blessed full moon Uposatha, a blessed Magha Puja, Sangha day, all today.

2020 Feb 06 20:30:12
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2020 Feb 04 14:45:08
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2020 Feb 01 06:40:40
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2020 Jan 31 10:22:34
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2020 Jan 31 07:05:45
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2020 Jan 30 11:25:07
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2020 Jan 30 08:44:22
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2020 Jan 30 05:03:27
Johann: Nyom

2020 Jan 30 03:22:25
Moritz: Vandami Bhante _/\_ _/\_ _/\_

2020 Jan 30 02:39:50
Moritz: Sadhu for good wishes, brother Vivek. Maybe good for another topic :) _/\_

2020 Jan 29 20:10:42
Vivek:  :-|  :) Be courageous for wholesomeness.  :-\  ^-^ but don't attach to it  _/\_  *sgift* . All Youngsters-- be a Veera(celibacy)  ;-)  to reach mahaveera(buddha).  Live and let others live in R.I.P.(rest in peace)  <.I.>

2020 Jan 29 16:05:37
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2020 Jan 29 13:44:04
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2020 Jan 29 13:43:56
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2020 Jan 29 13:43:46
Moritz: Bong Villa _/\_

2020 Jan 28 13:04:10
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2020 Jan 28 12:31:39
Johann: Atmas "sleeping rock" is always a well protected place. The fire now moving fast east into the village, may it case no harm and destruction for all.

2020 Jan 28 12:12:48
Cheav Villa: May Bhante could find a safe place during this fire time _/\_ _/\_ _/\_

2020 Jan 26 12:06:21
Cheav Villa: Vandami Bhante _/\_ _/\_ _/\_

2020 Jan 25 23:25:33
Johann: Nyom Villa

2020 Jan 24 09:58:40
Johann: As thought, incl. the Devas.

2020 Jan 24 08:29:47
Cheav Villa: He kept walking on road num 3 _/\_ _/\_ _/\_

2020 Jan 24 08:28:40
Cheav Villa: But could not help only giving drinking water. Bhante told his lost in this area 3days ago then he walr

2020 Jan 24 08:24:26
Cheav Villa: with Dad and Srey muk kamao, going to visit His Grand ma Grand pa. Fortunately he met Bhante Khmema kumara on the main road

2020 Jan 24 08:22:10
Cheav Villa: Kana Bhante this morning aroung 7.30 kana son arrived near Psar Tram kna on national road number3

2020 Jan 24 08:20:39
Cheav Villa: Sadhu Sadhu Sadhu  _/\_ _/\_ _/\_

2020 Jan 24 07:05:21
Johann: A blessed chinese new year, new moon Uposatha those who celebrate it today.

2020 Jan 23 21:53:22
Cheav Villa:  _/\_ _/\_ _/\_

2020 Jan 23 21:46:43
Johann: Sokh chomreoun

2020 Jan 23 21:25:30
Cheav Villa: Vandami Bhante :) _/\_ _/\_ _/\_

2020 Jan 23 11:48:02
Johann: A blessed and fruitful new moon Uposatha, those observing it today

2020 Jan 22 13:30:29
Johann: May Sukha come to fulfillment, Nyom. It's well for now.

2020 Jan 22 09:39:03
Danilo: did Bhante's health get better?

2020 Jan 22 09:37:11
Danilo: Bhante Johann _/\_

2020 Jan 21 19:20:53
Johann: Meister Moritz

2020 Jan 21 19:01:10
Moritz: Vandami Bhante _/\_ _/\_ _/\_

2020 Jan 21 13:09:02
Johann: Blind like ants are being believing in technic, scients and incapable to trace where and how effects take their cause.

2020 Jan 20 19:30:27
Moritz: Vandami Bhante _/\_ _/\_ _/\_

2020 Jan 19 20:32:04
Johann: Nyom Moritz

2020 Jan 19 20:29:34
Moritz: Vandami Bhante _/\_ _/\_ _/\_

2020 Jan 19 15:01:46
Johann: some moved to topic here

2020 Jan 19 10:20:11
Johann: Nyom Moritz

2020 Jan 19 10:03:16
Moritz: Vandami Bhante _/\_ _/\_ _/\_

2020 Jan 18 08:14:54
Moritz: _/\_ _/\_ _/\_

2020 Jan 18 05:57:52
Johann: A blessed and fruitful Sila day

2020 Jan 17 19:19:18
Moritz: Chom reap leah _/\_

2020 Jan 17 18:37:01
Cheav Villa:  _/\_

2020 Jan 17 18:14:15
Moritz: Bong Villa _/\_

2020 Jan 17 13:39:36
Sophorn: Many greetings to everyone,

2020 Jan 17 13:39:19
Sophorn:  _/\_ _/\_ _/\_

2020 Jan 17 10:29:19
Johann: "so, now I go up and clear the area a little, make some merits, and I will not share my merits, with anybody..."  ^-^

2020 Jan 17 08:49:11
Chanroth: ធ្វើអាស្រមហើយចេញពីរសេចក្ដីល្អ ធ្វើអ្វីដើម្បីខ្លួល្អជាង

2020 Jan 17 08:45:08
Chanroth: សូមលាហើយ

2020 Jan 17 08:33:16
Cheav Villa:  _/\_ _/\_ _/\_

2020 Jan 17 06:56:27
Johann: A blessed and fruitful Uposatha, those observing it today.

2020 Jan 17 06:45:45
Johann: Nyom Moritz

2020 Jan 17 06:44:49
Moritz: Vandami Bhante _/\_ _/\_ _/\_

2020 Jan 16 23:01:31
Moritz: Mr. Lew _/\_

2020 Jan 15 14:16:00
Cheav Villa:  _/\_ _/\_ _/\_

2020 Jan 15 11:15:29
Moritz: _/\_ _/\_ _/\_

2020 Jan 15 11:12:01
Johann: Nyom

2020 Jan 15 10:24:02
Cheav Villa: Master Moritz _/\_

2020 Jan 15 10:21:50
Moritz: Bong Villa _/\_

2020 Jan 15 10:11:56
Moritz: Vandami Bhante _/\_ _/\_ _/\_

2020 Jan 12 22:22:36
Moritz: Chom reap leah _/\_

2020 Jan 12 22:04:02
Moritz: _/\_

2020 Jan 12 21:34:30
Cheav Villa: Sadhu Sadhu Sadhu  _/\_ _/\_ _/\_

2020 Jan 12 21:31:02
Johann: Sokh chomreoun, may happiness come to fullfillment, all

2020 Jan 12 21:27:15
Cheav Villa: Master Moritz _/\_ Visitor _/\_

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Author Topic: Noble Wiedergeburt - Noble rebirth  (Read 759 times)

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Offline Johann

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Noble Wiedergeburt - Noble rebirth
« on: June 08, 2017, 07:35:35 AM »
Quote from: Samaneri Vimalanyani, in Questions​ on pre-anagami status auf d&d
Somewhat related to this topic, though dealing with rebirth in celestial realms instead of the human, is an4.191. (Don't read the English translation on SC, it is substantially different from Bhikkhu Bodhi's, and from translations in other languages.)

In gewisser Weise zu dem Thema passend, auch wenn es über Wiedergeburt in himmlischen Welten, anstelle von menschlicher, handelt, ist AN 4.191. (Ließ (oder habe gelesen) nicht die englische Übersetzung auf SC, sie ist wesentlich anders als die Bhikkhu Bodhis und Übersetzungen in andere Sprachen)

It's about a monastic who has "penetrated the teachings well by view". So I assume that means stream-entry, or at least dhammafollower/faithfollower status. If they pass away "with muddled mindfulness", they are reborn in a celestial realm and don't remember their former dhamma practice at first. However, some trigger helps them to remember, and then the memories come back instantly and "that being quickly reaches distinction". (Quotes from Bhikkhu Bodhi).

Sie handelt über einen Klösterlichen, der "die Lehren, in Sichtweise, gut durchdrungen hat". So nehme ich an, daß dieses Stromerreicher-, oder zumindest Dhamma/Vertrauensanhängerstatus bedeutet. Wenn diese mit "verwirrtem Geist" dahinscheiden, werden sie in einer himmlischen Welt wiedergeboren, und erinnern sich zuerst nicht an deren frühere Dhammaausübung. Doch einige Anstoße helfen ihnen sich zu erinnern, und kommt die Erinnerung unverzüglich zurück und "dieses Wesen erkennt geschwind die Unterscheidung (Zitate von Bhikkhu Bodhi)

This seems to indicate that a reborn sekha might not remember their unshakeable faith and former practice for a while, even when reborn in a celestial realm, where they just pop up with a fully developed body. In the human realm where development takes so long, it would be even more likely that that person would be ignorant about their former practice for a part of their life, until they somehow come in contact with the Dhamma. Then of course they should immediately recognize it.

Dieses scheint anzudeuten, daß ein wiedergeborener Sekha sich seinem unerschütterlichen Vertrauen und früherer Ausübung, für eine Weile, nicht erinnern mag, auch wenn in einer himmlischen Welt wiedergeboren, in der sie einfach mit voll entwickeltem Körper aufkommen. In der Menschenwelt, wo Entwicklung so lange dauert, werde es noch wahrscheinlicher, daß eine Person ignorant gegenüber deren früherer Ausübung, für einen Teil ihres Lebens, wäre, bis sie in irgend einer Weise in Kontakt mit dem Dhamma kommt. Doch dann sollten sie sich dem unverzüglich erinnern.

Es ist gut und für andere hilfreich, hier anzuknüpfen und weiter zu sprechen.
Wenn jemand Übersetzungen des Suttas im Einklang mit dem Dhamma und der Vinaya geben kann, wäre auch das gut.

Wenn nicht einfach selbst erinnert ist es einmal ein1 Mönch mit übermenschlichen Kräften, einmal ein Deva, einmal ein (bekannter) Geist. "Wie wenn Freunde sich wieder treffen: Kannst du dich noch erinnern? Weißt du noch?"


It is good and helpful for others, to stick to that and speak further.
If somebody is able to share translations of the Sutta in line of Dhamma Vinaya, also this would be good.

If not remembering simply by one self, its one time a monk with special powers, one time a Deva or one time a "familary" spirit. "Like as if old good friends meet each other: Do you still remenber? Do you remember how it was?"


Namo tassa bhagavato arahato sammā-sambuddhassa

1. Sotānugatasuttaṃ

Learning the Teaching

191. "Bhikkhus, if those hearing the Teaching were to practice it verbally, gather the meaning mentally and straighten the view they could expect four benefits. What four?

"Here, bhikkhus, the bhikkhu learns the Teaching as discourses, verse and prose sections, ... re ... and series of questions and answers and becomes learned in that Teaching, He practices it verbally, mentally gathers the meaning and he straightens his view. He dies with confused mindfulness and is born with a certain retinue of gods. There he skillfully voices the Teaching, too. Mindfulness arises to him slowly and he quickly rises to the next higher state. Bhikkhus, this is the first benefit for hearing the Teaching, practicing it verbally and mentally gathering the meaning and straightening the view.

"Again, bhikkhus, the bhikkhu learns the Teaching as discourses, verse and prose sections, ... re ... and series of questions and answers and becomes learned in that Teaching, He practices it verbally, mentally gathers the meaning and he straightens his view. He dies with confused mindfulness and is born with a certain retinue of gods. There he does not voice the Teaching skillfully, becomes successful in teaching the heavenly gathering. Then he recalls isn't it in this Teaching and Discipline that I earlier led the holy life. Mindfulness arises to him slowly and he quickly rises to the next higher state. Like a man clever in knowing the sound of drums, gone to the highway hears the sound of a drum and he does not doubt, whether it is the sound of a drum or not, but concludes it is the sound of a drum. In the same manner the bhikkhu learns the Teaching as discourses, verse and prose sections, ... re ... and series of questions and answers and becomes learned in that Teaching, He practices it verbally, mentally gathers the meaning and he straightens his view. He dies with confused mindfulness and is born with a certain retinue of gods. There he does not voice the Teaching skillfully, becomes successful in teaching the heavenly gathering. Then he recalls isn't it in this Teaching and Discipline that I earlier led the holy life. Mindfulness arises to him slowly and he quickly rises to the next higher state. Bhikkhus, this is the second benefit for hearing the Teaching, practicing it verbally and mentally gathering the meaning and straightening the view.

"Again, bhikkhus, the bhikkhu learns the Teaching as discourses, verse and prose sections, ... re ... and series of questions and answers and becomes learned in that Teaching, He practices it verbally, mentally gathers the meaning and he straightens his view. He dies with confused mindfulness and is born with a certain retinue of gods. There he voices the Teaching skillfully, but is not successful in teaching the heavenly gathering. Then he recalls isn't this the Discipline that I earlier led the holy life. Mindfulness arises to him slowly and he quickly rises to the next higher state. Like a man clever in knowing the sound of conches, gone to the highway hears the sound of a conch and he does not doubt, whether it is the sound of a conch or not, but concludes it is the sound of a conch. In the same manner the bhikkhu learns the Teaching as discourses, verse and prose sections, ... re ... and series of questions and answers and becomes learned in that Teaching, He practices it verbally, mentally gathers the meaning and he straightens his view. He dies with confused mindfulness and is born with a certain retinue of gods. There he voices the Teaching skillfully, but is not successful in teaching the heavenly gathering. Then he recalls isn't this the Discipline that I earlier led the holy life. Mindfulness arises to him slowly and he quickly rises to the next higher state. Bhikkhus, this is the third benefit for hearing the Teaching, practicing it verbally and mentally gathering the meaning and straightening the view.

"Again, bhikkhus, the bhikkhu learns the Teaching as discourses, verse and prose sections, ... re ... and series of questions and answers and becomes learned in that Teaching, He practices it verbally, mentally gathers the meaning and he straightens his view. He dies with confused mindfulness and is born with a certain retinue of gods. There he voices the Teaching skillfully, is not successful in teaching the heavenly gathering. Yet a spontaneously arisen one recognizes another spontaneously arisen and asks sir, 'Do you remember me?' He says, 'I remember you.' Mindfulness arises to him slowly and he quickly rises to the next higher state. Like two friends who had played together in their childhood were to meet each other some day. Then he would ask, 'Friend, do you remember me.' Then he would ask, 'Do you remember this and this', and he would say, 'Yes friend I remember.' In the same manner the bhikkhu learns the Teaching as discourses, verse and prose sections, ... re ... and series of questions and answers and becomes learned in that Teaching, He practices it verbally, mentally gathers the meaning and straightens his view. He dies with confused mindfulness and is born with a certain retinue of gods. There he voices the Teaching skillfully, is not successful in teaching the heavenly gathering. Yet a spontaneously arisen one recognizes another spontaneously arisen and asks sir, 'Do you remember me?' He says, 'I remember you.' Mindfulness arises to him slowly and he quickly rises to the next higher state. Bhikkhus, this is the fourth benefit for hearing the Teaching, practicing it verbally and mentally gathering the meaning and straightening the view.

"Bhikkhus, these are the four benefits for hearing the Teaching, practicing it verbally and mentally gathering the meaning and straightening the view."[/len]

Namo tassa bhagavato arahato sammā-sambuddhassa

សោតានុគតសូត្រ

[៤១] ម្នាលភិក្ខុទាំងឡាយ អានិសង្សទាំងឡាយ ៤ ប្រការ នៃធម៌ដែលចូលទៅ កាន់​ត្រចៀករឿយៗ ជាធម៌ដែលបុគ្គលចាំស្ទាត់ រត់មាត់ ចូលចិត្តច្បាស់លាស់ ចាក់ធ្លុះ ដោយទិដ្ឋិ គឺបញ្ញា រមែងកើតបា្រកដ។ អានិសង្ស ៤ ប្រការ តើដូចម្ដេច។ ម្នាលភិក្ខុទាំង​ឡាយ ភិក្ខុក្នុងសាសនានេះ រៀននូវធម៌ គឺ សុត្តៈ គេយ្យៈ វេយ្យាករណៈ គាថា ឧទានៈ ឥតិវុត្តកៈ ជាតកៈ អព្ភុតធម្មៈ វេទល្លៈ ធម៌ទាំងនោះ ជាសភាវៈ ចូលទៅកាន់ត្រចៀក រឿយៗ នៃភិក្ខុនោះ ដែលបានចាំស្ទាត់ រត់មាត់ ចូលចិត្តច្បាស់លាស់ ចាក់ធ្លុះដោយ ទិដ្ឋិបាន។ ភិក្ខុនោះ ភ្លេចស្មារតី ធ្វើមរណកាលទៅ រមែងចូលទៅកាន់ទេវនិកាយណា​មួយ ។ ចំណែកធម៌ទាំងឡាយ រមែងបា្រកដច្បាស់ ដល់ភិក្ខុនោះ ដែលមានសេចក្ដីសុខ ក្នុង​ទេវនិកាយនោះ។ ម្នាលភិក្ខុទាំងឡាយ ការកើតឡើងនៃសតិ ឈ្មោះថាជា ការយឺតយូរ[1] ឯសត្វនោះ វេលា​ដល់នូវគុណវិសេស ក៏ឆាប់រហ័សជាងសតិនោះ។ ម្នាលភិក្ខុទាំងឡាយ នេះជា​អានិសង្ស ទី១ នៃធម៌ ដែលចូលទៅកាន់ត្រចៀករឿយៗ ដែលបុគ្គលចាំស្ទាត់ រត់មាត់ ចូលចិត្តច្បាស់លាស់ ចាក់ឆ្លុះដោយទិដ្ឋិ រមែងកើតបា្រកដ។ ម្នាលភិក្ខុទាំងឡាយ មួយ​ទៀត ភិក្ខុរៀននូវធម៌ គឺ សុត្តៈ គេយ្យៈ វេយ្យាករណៈ គាថា ឧទានៈ ឥតិវុត្តកៈ ជាតកៈ អព្ភុតធម្មៈ វេទល្លៈ ធម៌ទាំងនោះ ជាសភាវៈ ចូលទៅកាន់ត្រចៀករឿយៗ នៃភិក្ខុនោះ​ ដែលបានចាំស្ទាត់ រត់មាត់ ចូលចិត្តច្បាស់លាស់ ចាក់ធ្លុះដោយទិដ្ឋិ។ ភិក្ខុនោះ ភ្លេច​ស្មារតី ធ្វើមរណកាលទៅ រមែងចូលទៅកាន់ទេវនិកាយណាមួយ។ ចំណែក​នៃធម៌​ទាំង​ឡាយ មិនសូវបា្រកដច្បាស់ ដល់ភិក្ខុនោះ ដែលមានសេចក្ដីសុខ ក្នុងទេវនិកាយនោះ ប៉ុន្តែ​ជាអ្នកមានឫទ្ធិ ដល់នូវសេចក្ដីស្ទាត់ជំនាញ ខាងផ្លូវចិត្ត សំដែងធម៌ ដល់ទេវបរិសទ្យ​បាន។ ទេវតានោះ មានសេចក្ដីត្រិះរិះ យ៉ាងនេះថា អាត្មាអញ បាន​ប្រព្រឹត្ត​ព្រហ្មចរិយៈ​អំពីមុន ក្នុងធម្មវិន័យណា នេះគឺធម្មវិន័យនោះឯង។ ម្នាលភិក្ខុទាំងឡាយ ការកើតឡើង នៃសតិ ឈ្មោះថា យឺតយូរ សត្វនោះ ដល់នូវគុណវិសេស ឆាប់រហ័សជាងសតិនោះ។ ម្នាល​ភិក្ខុទាំងឡាយ ប្រៀបដូចជាបុរស ជាអ្នកឈ្លាសវៃខាងសំឡេងស្គរ បុរសនោះ ដើរទៅកាន់ផ្លូវឆ្ងាយ បានឮសំឡេងស្គរ បុរសនោះ ក៏មិនមានសេចក្ដីសង្ស័យ ឬងឿងឆ្ងល់ នឹងសំឡេងស្គរនោះថា សំឡេងស្គរ​មែន ឬមិនមែនសំឡេងស្គរទេ ដូច្នេះឡើយ បុរសនោះ គប្បីដល់នូវសេចក្ដីចូលចិត្តថា សំឡេងស្គរដោយពិត មានឧបមាយ៉ាងណា ម្នាលភិក្ខុទាំងឡាយ ភិក្ខុរៀននូវធម៌ ក៏មាន​ឧបមេយ្យ ដូច្នោះដែរ។បេ។ ជា​អ្នក​ដល់​នូវគុណវិសេសឆាប់រហ័ស ម្នាលភិក្ខុទាំងឡាយ នេះជាអានិសង្ស ទី២ នៃធម៌ ដែល​ចូល​ទៅ​កាន់ត្រចៀករឿយៗ ដែលបុគ្គលចាំស្ទាត់​ រត់មាត់ ចូលចិត្តច្បាស់លាស់ ចាក់ធ្លុះដោយទិដ្ឋិ រមែងកើតបា្រកដ។ ម្នាលភិក្ខុទាំងឡាយ មួយទៀត ភិក្ខុរៀននូវធម៌គឺ សុត្តៈ គេយ្យៈ វេយ្យាករណៈ គាថា ឧទានៈ ឥតិវុត្តកៈ ជាតកៈ អព្ភុតធម្មៈ វេទល្លៈ ធម៌ទាំងនោះ ជាសភាវៈ ចូលទៅកាន់ត្រចៀករឿយៗ នៃភិក្ខុនោះ ដែលបានចាំស្ទាត់ រត់មាត់ ចូលចិត្តច្បាស់លាស់ ចាក់ធ្លុះដោយទិដ្ឋិ។ ភិក្ខុនោះ ភ្លេចស្មារតី ធ្វើមរណកាល​ទៅ រមែងចូលទៅកាន់ទេវនិកាយណាមួយ។ ចំណែកនៃធម៌ទាំងឡាយ មិនបា្រកដច្បាស់ ដល់​ភិក្ខុនោះ ដែលមានសេចក្ដីសុខ ក្នុងទេវនិកាយ​នោះឡើយ ទាំងមិនមែនជា​ភិក្ខុ​មានឫទ្ធិ ដល់នូវសេចក្ដីស្ទាត់ជំនាញ​ខាង​ផ្លូវចិត្ត ហើយសំដែងធម៌ ដល់ទេវបរិសទ្យ​បាន​ឡើយ។ គ្រាន់តែថា ទេវបុត្ត អាច​សំដែង​ធម៌ ដល់ទេវបរិសទ្យបានប៉ុណ្ណោះ។ ទេវបុត្តនោះ មានសេចក្ដីត្រិះរិះ យ៉ាងនេះថា អាត្មាអញ បានប្រព្រឹត្តព្រហ្មចរិយៈអំពីមុន ក្នុង​ធម៌​វិន័យ​ណា នេះគឺធម្មវិន័យនោះឯង។ ម្នាលភិក្ខុទាំងឡាយ ការកើតឡើងនៃសតិ ឈ្មោះថា យឺតយូរ សត្វនោះ ដល់នូវគុណ​វិសេស ឆាប់រហ័សជាងសតិនោះ។ ម្នាលភិក្ខុទាំងឡាយ ប្រៀបដូចបុរស ជាអ្នកឈ្លាសវៃ នឹងសំឡេងស័ង្ខ បុរសនោះ ដើរទៅកាន់ផ្លូវឆ្ងាយ បានឮសំឡេង​ស័ង្ខ បុរសនោះ ក៏មិនមាន​សេចក្ដីសង្ស័យ ឬងឿងឆ្ងល់​នឹង​សំឡេង​ស័ង្ខ​នោះថា សំឡេងស័ង្ខមែន ឬមិន​មែនសំឡេងស័ង្ខទេ បុរសនោះ គប្បីដល់នូវសេចក្ដី​ចូល​ចិត្តថា ជាសំឡេងស័ង្ខដោយពិត មានឧបមាយ៉ាងណា ម្នាលភិក្ខុទាំងឡាយ ភិក្ខុរៀន​នូវធម៌ ក៏មានឧបមេយ្យ ដូច្នោះ​ដែរ។បេ។ ជាអ្នកដល់នូវគុណវិសេសឆាប់រហ័ស។ ម្នាល​ភិក្ខុ​ទាំងឡាយ​ នេះជា​អានិសង្ស ទី៣ នៃធម៌ ដែលចូលទៅកាន់ត្រចៀករឿយៗ ដែល​បុគ្គល​ចាំស្ទាត់ រត់មាត់ ចូលចិត្ត​ច្បាស់លាស់ ចាក់ធ្លុះដោយទិដ្ឋិ រមែងកើតបា្រកដ។ ម្នាល​ភិក្ខុ​ទាំងឡាយ មួយទៀត ភិក្ខុរៀននូវធម៌ គឺសុត្តៈ គេយ្យៈ វេយ្យាករណៈ គាថា ឧទានៈ ឥតិវុត្តកៈ ជាតកៈ អព្ភុតធម្មៈ វេទល្លៈ ធម៌ទាំងនោះ ជាសភាវៈ ចូលទៅកាន់​ត្រចៀក​រឿយ​ៗ នៃភិក្ខុនោះ ដែលបានចាំស្ទាត់ រត់មាត់ ចូលចិត្តច្បាស់លាស់ ចាក់ធ្លុះដោយទិដ្ឋិ។ ភិក្ខុនោះ ក៏ភ្លេចស្មារតី ធ្វើមរណកាលទៅ​ រមែងចូលទៅកាន់ទេវនិកាយណាមួយ។ ចំណែកនៃធម៌ទាំងឡាយ មិនបា្រកដដល់ភិក្ខុនោះ ដែលមានសេចក្ដីសុខ ក្នុងទេវនិកាយ​នោះ ទាំងមិនមែនជាភិក្ខុមានឫទ្ធិ ដល់នូវការស្ទាត់ជំនាញខាងផ្លូវចិត្ត ហើយ​សំដែងធម៌ ដល់ទេវបរិសទ្យ ទាំងមិនមែនជាទេវបុត្ត អាចសំដែងធម៌ ដល់​ទេវបរិសទ្យបានទេ តែបើ​មាន​ឱបបាតិកសត្វ រំលឹកនូវឱបបាតិកសត្វថា ម្នាលគ្នាយើង ពួកយើងបាន​ប្រព្រឹត្តព្រហ្មចរិយៈ​អំពីមុន ក្នុងធម្មវិន័យណា អ្នករលឹកបាន នូវ​ធម្មវិន័យនោះដែរឬ។ ទេវបុត្ត​នោះ ក៏និយាយយ៉ាងនេះថា ម្នាលគ្នាយើង យើងរលឹកបាន ម្នាលគ្នាយើង យើង​រលឹកបាន។ ម្នាលភិក្ខុទាំងឡាយ ការកើតឡើងនៃសតិ ឈ្មោះថា យឺតយូរ សត្វនោះ ដល់​នូវគុណវិសេស ឆាប់រហ័សជាងសតិនោះ។ ម្នាលភិក្ខុទាំងឡាយ ប្រៀបដូចសំឡាញ់​ពីរនាក់ លេងអាចម៍ដីជាមួយគ្នា សំឡាញ់ទាំងពីរនាក់នោះ មកជួបគ្នា ក្នុងទីណាម្ដងៗ សំឡាញ់ម្នាក់ ក៏និយាយទៅនឹងសំឡាញ់ម្នាក់នោះ យ៉ាងនេះថា នែ​សំឡាញ់ ឯងរលឹក​បាននូវហេតុនេះដែរឬទេ។ សំឡាញ់នោះ គប្បីតបយ៉ាងនេះថា នែសំឡាញ់ អញរលឹក​បាន នែសំឡាញ់ អញរលឹកបាន មានឧបមាយ៉ាងណា ម្នាលភិក្ខុ​ទាំងឡាយ ភិក្ខុរៀន​នូវធម៌ ក៏មានឧបមេយ្យ ដូច្នោះដែរ។បេ។ ជាអ្នកដល់នូវគុណវិសេស​ឆាប់​រហ័ស។ ម្នាលភិក្ខុទាំងឡាយ នេះជាអានិសង្ស ទី៤ នៃធម៌ ដែលចូលទៅកាន់​ត្រចៀក​រឿយៗ ដែលបុគ្គលចាំស្ទាត់ រត់មាត់ ចូលចិត្តច្បាស់លាស់ ចាក់ធ្លុះដោយទិដ្ឋិ រមែងកើតបា្រកដ។ ម្នាលភិក្ខុទាំងឡាយ អានិសង្សទាំង ៤ ប្រការនេះនៃធម៌ ដែលចូល​ទៅ​កាន់ត្រចៀក​រឿយៗ​ ដែលបុគ្គលចាំស្ទាត់ រត់មាត់ ចូលចិត្តច្បាស់លាស់ ចាក់ឆ្លុះ​ដោយ​ទិដ្ឋិ រមែង​កើតបា្រកដ។
 1. ស្មារតីដែលកើតឡើង ១ភ្លែត ទុកជាយឺតយូរ ឯសត្វដែលមាន​អានិសង្ស​ធម៌​ក្នុងខ្លួន វេលានឹងសម្រេចមគ្គផល បានឆាប់រហ័សជាងស្មារតី១ភ្លែតនោះឯង។
Quote from: book 43

(Atma wird sich nun für seine Almosenrunde zurückziehen und die Khmer-Übersetzung später posten, da noch nicht geteilt.)
« Last Edit: June 08, 2017, 08:22:09 PM by Johann »
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Antw:Noble Wiedergeburt - Noble rebirth
« Reply #1 on: June 08, 2017, 10:15:16 AM »
Vielleicht möchte sich Upasaka Volker um eine deutsche Übersetzung für die Savaka Sangha annehmen. Hier das gegebene Pali dazu:

Namo tassa bhagavato arahato sammā-sambuddhassa

1. Sotānugatasuttaṃ

191. ‘‘Sotānugatānaṃ , bhikkhave, dhammānaṃ, vacasā paricitānaṃ, manasānupekkhitānaṃ, diṭṭhiyā suppaṭividdhānaṃ cattāro ānisaṃsā pāṭikaṅkhā. Katame cattāro? Idha, bhikkhave, bhikkhu dhammaṃ pariyāpuṇāti – suttaṃ, geyyaṃ, veyyākaraṇaṃ, gāthaṃ, udānaṃ, itivuttakaṃ, jātakaṃ, abbhutadhammaṃ, vedallaṃ. Tassa te dhammā sotānugatā honti, vacasā paricitā, manasānupekkhitā, diṭṭhiyā suppaṭividdhā. So muṭṭhassati [muṭṭhassatī (sī.)] kālaṃ kurumāno aññataraṃ devanikāyaṃ upapajjati. Tassa tattha sukhino dhammapadā plavanti [pilapanti (sī. syā. kaṃ. pī.)]. Dandho, bhikkhave, satuppādo; atha so satto khippaṃyeva visesagāmī hoti. Sotānugatānaṃ, bhikkhave, dhammānaṃ, vacasā paricitānaṃ, manasānupekkhitānaṃ, diṭṭhiyā suppaṭividdhānaṃ ayaṃ paṭhamo ānisaṃso pāṭikaṅkho.

‘‘Puna caparaṃ, bhikkhave, bhikkhu dhammaṃ pariyāpuṇāti – suttaṃ, geyyaṃ, veyyākaraṇaṃ, gāthaṃ, udānaṃ, itivuttakaṃ, jātakaṃ, abbhutadhammaṃ, vedallaṃ. Tassa te dhammā sotānugatā honti, vacasā paricitā, manasānupekkhitā, diṭṭhiyā suppaṭividdhā. So muṭṭhassati kālaṃ kurumāno aññataraṃ devanikāyaṃ upapajjati. Tassa tattha na heva kho sukhino dhammapadā plavanti; api ca kho bhikkhu iddhimā cetovasippatto devaparisāyaṃ dhammaṃ deseti. Tassa evaṃ hoti – ‘ayaṃ vā so dhammavinayo, yatthāhaṃ pubbe brahmacariyaṃ acari’nti. Dandho, bhikkhave, satuppādo; atha so satto khippameva visesagāmī hoti. Seyyathāpi, bhikkhave, puriso kusalo bherisaddassa. So addhānamaggappaṭipanno bherisaddaṃ suṇeyya. Tassa na heva kho assa kaṅkhā vā vimati vā – ‘bherisaddo nu kho, na nu kho bherisaddo’ti! Atha kho bherisaddotveva niṭṭhaṃ gaccheyya. Evamevaṃ kho, bhikkhave, bhikkhu dhammaṃ pariyāpuṇāti – suttaṃ, geyyaṃ, veyyākaraṇaṃ, gāthaṃ, udānaṃ, itivuttakaṃ, jātakaṃ, abbhutadhammaṃ, vedallaṃ. Tassa te dhammā sotānugatā honti, vacasā paricitā, manasānupekkhitā, diṭṭhiyā suppaṭividdhā. So muṭṭhassati kālaṃ kurumāno aññataraṃ devanikāyaṃ upapajjati. Tassa tattha na heva kho sukhino dhammapadā plavanti; api ca kho bhikkhu iddhimā cetovasippatto devaparisāyaṃ dhammaṃ deseti. Tassa evaṃ hoti – ‘ayaṃ vā so dhammavinayo, yatthāhaṃ pubbe brahmacariyaṃ acari’nti. Dandho, bhikkhave, satuppādo; atha so satto khippaṃyeva visesagāmī hoti. Sotānugatānaṃ, bhikkhave, dhammānaṃ , vacasā paricitānaṃ, manasānupekkhitānaṃ, diṭṭhiyā suppaṭividdhānaṃ ayaṃ dutiyo ānisaṃso pāṭikaṅkho.

‘‘Puna caparaṃ, bhikkhave, bhikkhu dhammaṃ pariyāpuṇāti – suttaṃ, geyyaṃ, veyyākaraṇaṃ, gāthaṃ, udānaṃ, itivuttakaṃ, jātakaṃ, abbhutadhammaṃ, vedallaṃ. Tassa te dhammā sotānugatā honti, vacasā paricitā, manasānupekkhitā, diṭṭhiyā suppaṭividdhā. So muṭṭhassati kālaṃ kurumāno aññataraṃ devanikāyaṃ upapajjati. Tassa tattha na heva kho sukhino dhammapadā plavanti, napi bhikkhu iddhimā cetovasippatto devaparisāyaṃ dhammaṃ deseti; api ca kho devaputto devaparisāyaṃ dhammaṃ deseti. Tassa evaṃ hoti – ‘ayaṃ vā so dhammavinayo, yatthāhaṃ pubbe brahmacariyaṃ acari’nti. Dandho, bhikkhave, satuppādo; atha so satto khippaṃyeva visesagāmī hoti. Seyyathāpi, bhikkhave, puriso kusalo saṅkhasaddassa. So addhānamaggappaṭipanno saṅkhasaddaṃ suṇeyya. Tassa na heva kho assa kaṅkhā vā vimati vā – ‘saṅkhasaddo nu kho, na nu kho saṅkhasaddo’ti! Atha kho saṅkhasaddotveva niṭṭhaṃ gaccheyya. Evamevaṃ kho, bhikkhave, bhikkhu dhammaṃ pariyāpuṇāti – suttaṃ, geyyaṃ, veyyākaraṇaṃ, gāthaṃ, udānaṃ, itivuttakaṃ, jātakaṃ, abbhutadhammaṃ, vedallaṃ. Tassa te dhammā sotānugatā honti, vacasā paricitā, manasānupekkhitā, diṭṭhiyā suppaṭividdhā. So muṭṭhassati kālaṃ kurumāno aññataraṃ devanikāyaṃ upapajjati. Tassa tattha na heva kho sukhino dhammapadā plavanti, napi bhikkhu iddhimā cetovasippatto devaparisāyaṃ dhammaṃ deseti; api ca kho devaputto devaparisāyaṃ dhammaṃ deseti. Tassa evaṃ hoti – ‘ayaṃ vā so dhammavinayo, yatthāhaṃ pubbe brahmacariyaṃ acari’nti. Dandho, bhikkhave, satuppādo; atha so satto khippaṃyeva visesagāmī hoti. Sotānugatānaṃ, bhikkhave, dhammānaṃ, vacasā paricitānaṃ, manasānupekkhitānaṃ, diṭṭhiyā suppaṭividdhānaṃ ayaṃ tatiyo ānisaṃso pāṭikaṅkho.

‘‘Puna caparaṃ, bhikkhave, bhikkhu dhammaṃ pariyāpuṇāti – suttaṃ, geyyaṃ, veyyākaraṇaṃ, gāthaṃ, udānaṃ, itivuttakaṃ, jātakaṃ, abbhutadhammaṃ, vedallaṃ. Tassa te dhammā sotānugatā honti, vacasā paricitā, manasānupekkhitā, diṭṭhiyā suppaṭividdhā. So muṭṭhassati kālaṃ kurumāno aññataraṃ devanikāyaṃ upapajjati. Tassa tattha na heva kho sukhino dhammapadā plavanti, napi bhikkhu iddhimā cetovasippatto devaparisāyaṃ dhammaṃ deseti, napi devaputto devaparisāyaṃ dhammaṃ deseti; api ca kho opapātiko opapātikaṃ sāreti – ‘sarasi tvaṃ, mārisa, sarasi tvaṃ , mārisa, yattha mayaṃ pubbe brahmacariyaṃ acarimhā’ti. So evamāha – ‘sarāmi, mārisa, sarāmi, mārisā’ti. Dandho, bhikkhave, satuppādo; atha so satto khippaṃyeva visesagāmī hoti. Seyyathāpi, bhikkhave, dve sahāyakā sahapaṃsukīḷikā [sahapaṃsukīḷakā (syā. kaṃ.)]. Te kadāci karahaci aññamaññaṃ samāgaccheyyuṃ. Añño pana [samāgaccheyyuṃ, tamenaṃ (sī. syā. kaṃ. pī.)] sahāyako sahāyakaṃ evaṃ vadeyya – ‘idampi, samma, sarasi, idampi, samma, sarasī’ti. So evaṃ vadeyya – ‘sarāmi , samma, sarāmi, sammā’ti. Evamevaṃ kho, bhikkhave, bhikkhu dhammaṃ pariyāpuṇāti – suttaṃ, geyyaṃ, veyyākaraṇaṃ, gāthaṃ, udānaṃ, itivuttakaṃ, jātakaṃ, abbhutadhammaṃ, vedallaṃ. Tassa te dhammā sotānugatā honti, vacasā paricitā, manasānupekkhitā, diṭṭhiyā suppaṭividdhā. So muṭṭhassati kālaṃ kurumāno aññataraṃ devanikāyaṃ upapajjati. Tassa tattha na heva kho sukhino dhammapadā plavanti, napi bhikkhu iddhimā cetovasippatto devaparisāyaṃ dhammaṃ deseti, napi devaputto devaparisāyaṃ dhammaṃ deseti; api ca kho opapātiko opapātikaṃ sāreti – ‘sarasi tvaṃ, mārisa, sarasi tvaṃ, mārisa, yattha mayaṃ pubbe brahmacariyaṃ acarimhā’ti. So evamāha – ‘sarāmi, mārisa, sarāmi, mārisā’ti. Dandho, bhikkhave, satuppādo; atha kho so satto khippaṃyeva visesagāmī hoti. Sotānugatānaṃ, bhikkhave, dhammānaṃ, vacasā paricitānaṃ, manasānupekkhitānaṃ, diṭṭhiyā suppaṭividdhānaṃ ayaṃ catuttho ānisaṃso pāṭikaṅkho. Sotānugatānaṃ, bhikkhave, dhammānaṃ, vacasā paricitānaṃ, manasānupekkhitānaṃ diṭṭhiyā suppaṭividdhānaṃ ime cattāro ānisaṃsā pāṭikaṅkhā’’ti. Paṭhamaṃ.

Atma wird Bhikkhu Bodhi im Bezug auf eine englische Übersetzung ansprechen, oder aber es möchte jemand Bhante Thanissaro darauf ansprechen, Nyom Kaethi vielleicht?
« Last Edit: June 08, 2017, 08:01:57 PM by Johann »
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On Being of Noble birth - Stream winner reborn as human
« Reply #2 on: June 17, 2017, 04:57:40 PM »

Aramika   *

Ein oder mehrer Beiträge wurden hier im Thema abgeschnitten und damit in neues Thema "On Being of Noble birth - Stream winner reborn as human " eröffnet. Bitte scheuen Sie nicht davor zurück, etwaigen Rat oder Kritik dazu mitzuteilen.  Viel Freude und Inspiration auch im neuen Thema. Anumodana!

One or more posts have been cut out of this topic here. A new topic, based on it, has been created as "On Being of Noble birth - Stream winner reborn as human " . Please do not hesitate to claim or give supporting hints.  Much joy and inspiration also in the new Topic. Anumodana!
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