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Author Topic: [En] Karma and Gratitude, Bhante Thanissaro  (Read 230 times)

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Offline Johann

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[En] Karma and Gratitude, Bhante Thanissaro
« on: July 13, 2017, 02:51:40 PM »
Karma & Gratitude

eveningtalk, given by Ven. Thanissaro Bhikkhu at Wat Metta

9.June 2017/2561

~14 min., 7,6 MB

Generously shared via dhammatalks.org


Download: http://sangham.net/index.php?action=tpmod;dl=get515
This post and Content has come to be by Dhamma-Dana and so is given as it       Dhamma-Dana: Johann

Offline Sophorn

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Re: [En] Karma and Gratitude, Bhante Thanissaro
« Reply #1 on: September 22, 2017, 06:15:49 PM »
 _/\_ _/\_ _/\_
Karma and Gratitude
A Dhammatalk given by Bhante Thanissaro

When the Buddha talks about gratitude he does so on the context of the teaching on karma and rebirth. And it's worth thinking of the implications of that are: when he's talking about mondial in review.
That there are good and bad actions, and these actions have results. (But) in this lifetime onto the next. He mentions as just in phrase: There is mother and father, which seems almost too obvious to say. We all have mothers and fathers. But when he meant them in the context in the time was that you owe them gratitude to, and it's because of the nature of karma that you do.
There are people who thought that whatever people do is totally influenced or totally determined by say, the stars or some creator, God, by their ___ , in other words, people don't have choices. It's when yor parents told you that they had no choice, no matter. When they raised you they had no choice, no matter. It's just what they had to do. And so there is no special effect of gratitude there. It's just influences from the stars or influences from whatever else acting through them.
But the Buddhist teaching on karma has several features that make gratitude an appropriate response. One is that we have freedom of choice. Our actions are real. And they come from our intentions and we have a choice on what choice of intentions we have to act on.
So when someone does anything good to you, it does have a meaning. It was a choice. Even if they had to go out of their way, if they had to make sacrifices - it's worth your gratitude.

(But) the word for gratitude in Pali (is) "kataññū" contains the root "kata". "Kata" comes from the word "to do". You literally know and appreciate what has been done. This is why gratitude is different from general appreciation. We can appreciate the trees, we can appreciate the weather right now. It's making it easy to practise. But there's noone doing that.

We want to argue a creator, God, is doing that: Why is it more difficult for a God to do things pleasantly than unpleasantly? But the Buddha's teachings are just the way things are in terms of the way it rather works, the way plans work. They have no decisions in no matter. And it's when people make the decision to be on a parade and do something good. That requires special response on your part, both for the person who is good to you. You want to repay that goodness. And also fo your own realization that other peole may benefit from your going on of your way for them, unless you want to spread goodnes around. This kind of reflection opens your heart, widens your heart, makes you more likely who want to go out of your way.

There is a sentence, I'm not sure if it's Thai or is it in the Pali Canon: "Gratitude is a sign of a good person." It is chipped out for this reason. If someone appreciates the goodness of other people done and demand that they had to go out of their way. There where all kinds of difficulties. That makes it more likely that they themselves will be willing to go out of their way to be helpful, to be good.

(4:00) There is a case here as "Bheagwa"… The family lived down there from the monastery. They had a big ruckus one night. The son from the father's previous marriage came back. He was an adult now. They had a huge argument. The father It came to huge aguments with his Father. (He) kicked him downstairs, (and) broke both his legs. When the news came to the monastery Ajahn Fuang's first comment was: "You can never trust that son. If he was willing to do this to his father, he wil do it with anybody."
So, gratitude is a sign of a good person. And it is an attitude that gives rise to more goodness within us.

(4:40) In particular, what the Buddha talks about the debt we have to our parents, because, after all, our lives, we have our body because of them. Even if they weren't the best parents, at least, we have this human life, and this particular body right now, so they have particularly deserving the feeling of gratitude. Now the Buddha said the best way to repay that is: If they are stingy people you try them to be generous. If they are not virtuous you try teach them to be virtuous. In other words, whatever goodness they are not alike you try to influence them some in that direction. And, of course, you know how hard it to teach your parents. You have to be really subtle and very wise in how you do that. But it i possible. I have seen cases. They'll reflect further on that. The Buddha's teachings on parents is… There is that statement you will never meet - or it will be very hard to meet someone who hasn't been your mother or father in the past. Now some people take that and say that means you should feel affectionate to everybody because they have been your parent, one or another.
But the Buddha takes it into a different direction: He says you give rise in a sense of dismay. All these times you have been parents and all the times, all these parents you've been parents to somebody else. That's back and forth, back and forth, back and forth like this, and we know that's like between children and parents.

This also fits into the teaching of karma: There's straight clear karma and there's dark karma. Clear karma crosses good karma and dharma with good intentions and dark karma, dharma with bad intentions mixed; and then, there is a karma that leads away from karma, leads to an end of karma. And you look at the karma we have with everyone around us. We've had - who knows how long - and it's going to be a real mixture: clear and dark.

And what your parents want: satisfactory. And then, you've been a parent sometimes and, of course, what you do besides satisfactory to your children, too, and so karma goes back and forth, between clear and dark, clear and dark.
(7.12) It never gets anywhere, unless you decide to get out. So it's another good reflection. One of the best you can do to the whole mass of people who - all these people who've been your parents and all the people who you've been parents of in the past. It's just: get out of the system. That's what we're doing as we meditate. That's why the reflection on gratitude is one useful way of getting the mind to be willing to settle down in the present moment, realizing "This is the way, as the Buddha said, that's karma but leads to the end of karma. All the entanglement ___ was karma. So, at ___?

This is the first semon of the Eight Noble Truths. Everythi from right view onto right concentration. That's the karma that leads to the end of karma. So, it's working on concentration, in other words, basically right now it's right effort, right mindfulness,right concentration altogether. It's what we're trying to develop. That's part of this karma that gets us out of this tangle. And give the best possible way of repaying the people that we've been so immediately connected with before. We can dedicate to give goodness to them. If the appreciate it, they will benefit.
So you take your mind around the world, take your mind around a huge span of time, and then you zero when on the present moment, because the present moment is the way out.

(8:56) This is the same pattern that the Buddha thought the night he was awakening. His first knowledge was about time and how far it goes back. And all the narratives of his life. If you think you had narratives, sit down here. The Buddha has thousands of thousands of them. Thus, having so many that it got reduced to the bare essentials: This is what he looked like, what his name was or what he was called. This is experience of pleasure and pain. This is what he ate and this is how he died. That's life. Five sentences. No one after the another. ___ that you're pretty tying up in the narratives. The next question is: Does everybody else is following this pattern, too?

(9.42) The second knowledge is awareness spread to fill the entire universe. You realize that everybody goes through that process and then seeing that, in fact, everybody went through this process, he also thought: What drove it? Basically, it was intentions. And intentions were skillful or unskillful depending whether they were based on right view or wrong view.
So, the third question was what kind of intentions lead out? That's when he gained the knowledge that he was awakening. So, sometimes, you just sit down to meditate. It's good to think about past expenses of time, past expenses of the universe to see the common patterns and then realize that the common patterns are generated here in your mind in the present moment.

(10.31) Which is why we're working right here. The working on your mind here and working on your intentions trying to get some control of your intentions as a gift to yourself and the people around you. That is one of the good things that the Buddha talks about, merit. It's basically instructions how to find happiness and the engagement of the world in a way that doesn't cause any suffering, that doesn't cause any harm to anybody. In other words, happiness spreads around. And meditation is one of those activities where the happiness, where the goodness spreads around.This is most clearly if you've been meditating and the mind is filled with anger before the time to meditate. But with the time you're done the anger has subsided. That means you've saved the people around you from theventer that might have been expressed in your words or your deeds.

(11.34) And the more time you give to meditation the more you try them on, the more deep the results become. And the more deep the impact ___ are on other people. So, all that contemplation comes under what the Buddha calls generating desire. It's part of right effort generating desire to do something skillful. To understand what action is and your power of choice, unless you are going to use that power well. You're not like the congress man in that New Yorker cartoon when he's coming down the steps the capitalist is saying: What use of power when you cannot use it? What kind of power? "If you abuse it, you're going to to be the one who is abused!"

The one who uses power of choice - you want to choose it well. And you can. The Buddha is showing you how. Instructions are not superhuman. If said it was thought as superhuman he wouldn't have taught them. That's when the mind feels tempted to go out... some play sounds. Remind yourself: Do what you're doing right here, being with your breath! And you may not see the results you want right away. At least, is headed into the right direction. We don't just sit in the present moment. The present moment is an arrow that moves into he future. Timehas an arrow. Tin me has any arrow. That's what you do now will have an impact now and on into the future.
So, sometimes, the immediate impact is not what you want when it's not as good1 as you want but it's headed in the right direction. It's part of a path. The path that leads to knowledge, the path that leads to awakening. The path that leads to goodness all around.

So, when you're tempted to slip off the path, remind yourself: it's hard to find a path this good. Ann's whenever you're slipping off, is pretty miserable in comparison.
And so, in this way, that reflection and gratitude in the context of karma can bring you right here. Doing what you should be doing in terms of the duties of the Four Noble Truths. Duties that are imposed on you, but you want to put an end to suffering - and this is how it's done and here's your opportunity to do it!
So let that thought be uplifting!

 _/\_ _/\_ _/\_

N.B.: Einige Passagen sind unklar oder ev. falsch geschrieben , daher sind Korrekturen jederzeit willkommen.

[Johann bemerkt]
« Last Edit: September 23, 2017, 03:00:41 PM by Johann »

Offline Johann

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Re: [En] Karma and Gratitude, Bhante Thanissaro
« Reply #2 on: September 23, 2017, 02:31:55 PM »
Sadhu! Nyom Sophorn .

* The father kicked him downstairs, broke both his legs.

Scheint ein "Versprecher" von Bhante zu sein, oder ein The father kicked "by" him downstairs, broke both his legs.

(Atma gerade mitten im Lesen)

Oh nein... Punkt! Son of previous marriage... (Then it) Came to huge arguments with, the father... (He -the son) kicked him downstairs, broke both his legs.

Past auch zum Kontext, wenn nochmal angehört.
(Satzteilschlucker wie Atma, Bhante, wenn's um "Geschichten geht)

* There is a case here as "Bheagwa"

Vielleicht: "There is a case here, as back, where... (herausgeschnitten, die Einleitung?) Oder der Ort von Ajahn Fuangs Kloster? Aber dann paßt das "here" nicht in den Kontext.

* There are people who thought that whatever people do is totally influenced or totally determined by say, the stars or some creator, God, (or) by their past karma, in other words, people ...

* That's why the reflection on gratitude is one useful way of getting the mind to be willing to settle down in the present moment, realizing this is the way, as the Buddha said, that's karma but leads to the end of karma, and all the entanglement(s) that come(s) with karma.

* ___ that you're pretty tying up in the narratives. Aus em Kontext vielleicht: ...but it is not so that he (oder you) get up caught in the narratives:... d.h: "die Geschichte endet nicht hiermit (den Geschichten von früher)"
« Last Edit: September 23, 2017, 03:43:04 PM by Johann »
This post and Content has come to be by Dhamma-Dana and so is given as it       Dhamma-Dana: Johann

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Johann

October 16, 2017, 05:40:03 PM
Sokh chomreoun, Nyom. (Mag sukha sich für Nyom mehren). Thoamada (Dhammada - naturly, gewohnt). At mean ay pisech te (nichts besonders). Klach dukkh, klach sokh (wohl und weh wechseln sich ab). Nyom sokh sabay dea te? Sokh leumom dea te?
 

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 :-* ehrwürdiger samana johann! wie ist ihr befinden?  :-*
 

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October 07, 2017, 02:48:39 AM
Der Tathagata tut das, wenn man ihn in seinem Dhamma sieht, und dieser, entgegen Personen, kommt auf wenn man ihn nährt, und einmal da, geht er für einen nicht mehr verloren, bleibt Tor zur Todlosigkeit.
 

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October 06, 2017, 11:37:24 PM
 :-*
 

Marcel

October 06, 2017, 11:36:31 PM
 :-* ehrwürdiger samana johann :-* mögen sie noch lange leben,   für das wohl vieler.... anumodana, ich freue mich sehr! sie decken auf, was vorher verdeckt. so das vijja entstehen kann, und avijja gehen muss!! geht direkt ins herz!
 

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Nyom Marcel.
 

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September 28, 2017, 03:51:05 AM
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Johann

September 27, 2017, 12:17:53 PM
Nyom Sophorn, Roben mag man immer geben können. Im Monat nach dem Vassa Ende, ist es für jene Mönche, die den Vassa gehalten haben, möglich und einfacher für den Eigenbedarf Roben anzunehmen.
 

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September 27, 2017, 07:01:23 AM
Bhante, ist dann die Robengabe möglich ab dem 5. Okt. bid zum nächsten Vollmond oder darf man auch danach Roben geben? :-*
 

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September 27, 2017, 05:44:45 AM
Wie geht es Bhante heute? Haben die Tropfen geholfen?
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Gerestet: funktioniert tadellos. Nochmal alle Zugangsdaten gemailt, Nyom.
 

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Kana hat mit U. Chamroeun das Login mit neuem Passwort erfolglos versucht.
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Sollte email im Posteingang haben, Nyom Sophorn.
 

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Kann nicht antworten auf was, Nyom Maria? Was und wo genauer?

Nyom Sophorn. Nyom Chomroeun kann kurzlich email Daten bekommen. Mal annehmend das PW auch vergessen, (abgesenhen von der Möglichkeit, link zu drücken wenn) wird Atma ein neues anlegen und ihm mailen.
 

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August 20, 2017, 01:37:40 AM
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August 10, 2017, 11:31:40 AM
Wenn jemand Lust hat, oder anderen etwas Gutes oder Besseres tun kann und möchte: Korrekturlesen http://sangham.net/index.php/topic,1018.msg9625.html#msg9625 Baue nach und nach, so gut wie möglich ein auf ZzE.
 

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August 07, 2017, 02:24:55 AM
Einen ausübungsreichen Vollmond-Uposatha and Gelegenheit die Mönche zu besuchen wünscht meine Person.
 

Sophorn

July 25, 2017, 03:59:03 PM
... versteht und womöglich sieht, wenn er nicht den Weg hierher
findet.

Großer Dank an alle im Hintergrund.

Mögen all diese Früchte vielfach zurückkommen und inspirieren.

Ayu vanno sukkham balam

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July 25, 2017, 03:55:25 PM
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Herzliches Hallo an alle nach sehr langem!

Ein herzliches Dankeschön aus tiefsten Herzen an alle, die sich hier aktiv und indirekt hier beteiligen. Vor allem ein großes Sadhu an Bhante, der unvergleichliche Arbeit leistet, die kaum jemand ver
 

Johann

July 24, 2017, 03:15:56 AM
Fehlinvestition: Was immer man nicht in die Juwelen, in den Pfad investiert, ist vergeude Mühe, schnurrr einen fest im Rad des Leidens. Prüfen Sie es!   :) Wiederholungstäter...
 

Johann

July 17, 2017, 01:50:17 AM
Moritz
 

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July 16, 2017, 02:28:02 PM
Namasakara, Bhante _/\_
 

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July 14, 2017, 07:07:17 AM
Moritz. Gut ihn früh Morgens und nicht bis in den frühen Morgen zu sehen.
 

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July 13, 2017, 08:12:46 AM
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July 13, 2017, 07:42:39 AM
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Moritz

July 13, 2017, 07:40:46 AM
Namasakara, Bhante _/\_
 

Johann

July 08, 2017, 02:26:09 AM
Vor mehr als 2500 Jahen wurde a diesem Vollmondtag das Rad des Dhammas in bewegung gesetzt. Anumodana!
 

Mohan Gnanathilake

July 02, 2017, 08:24:13 AM
Sehr ehrwürdiger Samanera Johann,

ich bedanke mich bei Ihnen für Ihre nette Erklärung.

Dhamma Grüße an Sie aus Sri Lanka!

 

Johann

July 01, 2017, 07:43:41 PM
Nyom Mohan. Besser: "Ich hoffe, daß es Ihnen gut geht." und bestens (ohne suggerieren, wenn interessiert) "Wie geht es Ihnen." Oder: "Möge es Ihnen Gut gehen." (wenn metta ausdrücken wollend)
 

Mohan Gnanathilake

July 01, 2017, 10:43:15 AM
Sehr ehrwürdiger Samanera Johann,

ich glaube, dass es Ihnen gut geht.

Dhamma Grüße an Sie aus Sri Lanka!
 

Mohan Gnanathilake

July 01, 2017, 10:32:46 AM
Werter Micro,
herzliche Grüße aus Sri Lanka nach Deutschland!
 

Johann

July 01, 2017, 10:32:17 AM
Nyom Mohan.
 

Johann

June 25, 2017, 01:38:38 PM
Alles Zufälle. Nissaya. Und wenn da keine starke Grundlagenursache aufkommt, upanissayapaccayena, na dann war's das, und alles is weg. Lebewesen sind Erben ihrer Taten (im Geist, Wort und Körper).
 

Johann

June 25, 2017, 01:27:24 PM
Schwupps und weg. Waffen und Nahrung geholt.

Oh, was sag ich. Wenn man's doch nehmen kann, auch ohne das Gefühl zu nehmen... Unsinn hier. Hat doch keiner interesse Verdienste zu tun.
 

Johann

June 25, 2017, 01:21:28 PM
Mirco. Wie geht es?
 

Johann

June 25, 2017, 01:20:43 PM
Es ist doch viel angenehmer, wenn man sich nehmen kann was und wann immer man will, oder? Warum sollte man sich so viel antun, da sind genügend die Anbieten.
 

Johann

June 14, 2017, 06:45:07 PM
Jetzt aber vorerst. Möge jeder guten Unterhalt (ung) im Dhamma und Stärkung finden uud sich davon reichlich nehmen.
 

Mohan Gnanathilake

June 11, 2017, 08:24:45 AM
Werter Harry,

ich freue mich darüber, nach einigen Monaten wieder auf sangham.net Sie zu grüßen.

Herzliche Grüße aus Sri Lanka nach Deutschland!
 

Johann

June 09, 2017, 05:05:59 PM
Mögen sich alle, möge sich Guest der Uposatha-Einhaltung nicht nur heute annehmen, und glücksverheißende Zeit verbringen.

May all, may Guest not only today observe the Uposatha and spend auspicious time
 

Mohan Gnanathilake

June 03, 2017, 01:48:08 AM
Sehr ehrwürdiger Samanera Johann,

es geht mir zur Zeit gut. Ich glaube, dass es Ihnen auch gut geht.

Dhamma Grüße an Sie aus Sri Lanka!
 

Johann

June 02, 2017, 11:19:32 PM
Wie geht es Upasaka Mohan?
 

Mohan Gnanathilake

June 02, 2017, 10:51:50 PM
Wie sehr ehrwürdiger Samanera Johann geschrieben hat, hatte ich am 10. Mai 2017 meinen  Geburtstag, an dem Tag  in diesem Jahr das Wesakfest gefeiert wurde.
Beste Grüße an Sie aus Sri Lanka!
Mohan Barathi Gnanathilake
 

Johann

June 02, 2017, 12:33:54 PM
Wußte doch, daß so Nahrung immer gefressen werden will.  :)
"Sehr gut, weiter hungern."

Freut das Nyom Marcel wohlauf ist.
 

Marcel

June 02, 2017, 12:20:52 PM
weil "keines" immer noch die bezugnahme auf eines hat!

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