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Talkbox

2019 Feb 21 03:15:02
Cheav Villa:  _/\_

2019 Feb 20 15:56:46
Johann: see here

2019 Feb 20 13:33:02
Cheav Villa: ពូចាន់រ័ត្ន សុំអោយសួរព្រះអង្គ តើម្សិលមិញ រឺ​ម្សិលម្ង៉ៃ​ មានមនុស្ស​ប្រុសម្នាក់ស្រីម្នាក់ ឡើងទៅលើភ្នំ ឬទេ?

2019 Feb 20 13:31:37
Cheav Villa: ថ្វាយបង្គំ​ព្រះអង្គ  _/\_ _/\_ _/\_

2019 Feb 18 14:34:39
Johann: Meister Moritz

2019 Feb 18 13:29:24
Moritz: Leaving. May Bhante and all have a good day. _/\_

2019 Feb 18 13:18:25
Moritz: _/\_

2019 Feb 18 09:31:39
Cheav Villa:  _/\_

2019 Feb 18 08:19:34
Johann: Where and what to practice?

2019 Feb 18 08:15:08
Johann: Where and when ever good inspired and worthy to give into.

2019 Feb 18 08:14:03
Johann: That place here is not that different, and Nyom did already a lot here. And don't forget: Punna iomething that arises in ones heart, not outwardly.

2019 Feb 18 07:34:01
Cheav Villa: ជាមួយនឹង​ក្រុម​​លោកម្ចាស់​ស្រេង​   _/\_ _/\_ _/\_

2019 Feb 18 07:32:56
Cheav Villa: កូណាមិនបានទៅចូលរួមមាឃបូជានៅឱរ៉ាល់ឆ្នាំនេះ តែសង្ឃឹមនឹងបានទៅចូលរួម​ពិធីឡើងកុដិនៅខែ3 

2019 Feb 18 03:52:46
Cheav Villa:  _/\_ _/\_ _/\_

2019 Feb 18 01:21:42
Khemakumara:  _/\_ _/\_  _/\_

2019 Feb 18 01:21:10
Khemakumara:  _/\_ _/\_ _/\_

2019 Feb 18 01:16:11
Johann: Bhante. Nyom Villa.

2019 Feb 18 01:14:29
Johann: Nyom Moritz. Sokh chomreoun

2019 Feb 18 00:34:02
Moritz: Vandami Bhante _/\_

2019 Feb 15 04:14:01
Cheav Villa:  _/\_ _/\_ _/\_

2019 Feb 15 03:43:29
Johann: Another day, another possibility. We don't know what tomorrow might be

2019 Feb 15 03:43:01
Johann: ថ្ងៃ ថ្មី មួូយ ជា ឳកាស ថ្មី មួយ ទៀត។ យើង មិន អាច ដឹង មុន នូវ អ្វី ដែល នឹង កើតឡើង ថ្ងៃ ស្អែក

2019 Feb 12 05:47:26
Johann: Nyom Chanroth

2019 Feb 11 07:35:04
Khemakumara:  _/\_ _/\_ _/\_

2019 Feb 11 07:01:15
Johann: Bhante

2019 Feb 10 15:18:50
Vithou: Hope Preah Ang doing well too.. Thanks Preah Ang

2019 Feb 10 15:17:51
Vithou: Nhom kuna doing well so far.

2019 Feb 10 12:29:57
Johann: Nyom Vithou. But Nyom is well so far?

2019 Feb 10 12:02:00
Vithou: Actually they put in the kidnee. :)

2019 Feb 10 12:01:26
Vithou:  take it out on 20 Feb

2019 Feb 10 12:01:25
Vithou:  take it out on 20 Feb

2019 Feb 10 12:01:12
Vithou: the doctor put it for one month . I will

2019 Feb 10 12:00:28
Vithou: Kuna Tvay Bongkom Preah Ang  nyom kuna is fne now but still have a pipe inside mybody

2019 Feb 10 11:47:41
Johann: Sokh chomreoun Nyom Buddhi

2019 Feb 10 11:44:41
Ieng Puthy: ករុណាខានបានចូលមកក្នុងវេបសាយអានព្រះធម៌អស់ប៉ុន្មានថ្ងៃ

2019 Feb 10 11:41:53
Ieng Puthy: 🙏🏻🙏🏻🙏🏻ករុណាថ្វាយបង្គំុ Vandami Bhante

2019 Feb 09 14:43:21
Cheav Villa: សួស្តី​ពូចាន់រ័ត្ម _/\_

2019 Feb 09 14:42:08
Johann: ញោម Chanroth

2019 Feb 09 11:32:48
Johann: ខ្លះ ... how ever, good to here

2019 Feb 09 10:30:33
Cheav Villa: វិធូថាគាត់បានធូរខ្លះហើយ គាត់នឹងរកពេលទូលព្រះអង្គ តាម​Talk box  _/\_

2019 Feb 09 02:49:21
Cheav Villa: កូណាបានសួរគាត់ដែរ តែមិនទាន់មានការឆ្លើយតបទេ ប្រហែលជាគាត់រវល់ខ្លាំង  _/\_

2019 Feb 08 15:24:14
Johann: How is Nyom Vithou doing, Nyom Villa? Nyom Chanroth told that he still has burden after the hospital.

2019 Feb 07 13:07:06
Cheav Villa:  _/\_ _/\_ _/\_

2019 Feb 07 13:04:40
Johann: Nearly out of power("suns gift") for today again. May all give into good deeds with their power left.

2019 Feb 07 13:04:33
Johann: Nearly out of power("suns gift") for today again. May all give into good deeds with their power left.

2019 Feb 05 13:35:45
Johann: Meister Vinodh

2019 Feb 05 08:45:20
Johann: មុដិតា

2019 Feb 05 07:46:50
Cheav Villa: អរព្រះគុណ​ ព្រះអង្គ  _/\_ _/\_ _/\_ ពួកខ្ញុំកូណា បានធូរស្បើយ​ច្រើន​ អំពីបញ្ហាសុខភាពរាងកាយ​  _/\_

2019 Feb 05 07:25:29
Johann: Nyom Villa. Family, all healthy and well?

2019 Feb 05 03:34:18
Johann: Mr. Nathan

2019 Feb 04 13:42:11
Cheav Villa:  _/\_

2019 Feb 04 04:25:07
Cheav Villa: កូណា​ត្រេកអរ​ ដែលបានឃើញផ្លូវទៅមុខ ឧបនិស្ស័យ​ការបដិបត្តិ​ឧបោសថ​យឺតយូរ​  _/\_ _/\_ _/\_

2019 Feb 04 04:22:09
Cheav Villa: ការហាត់ធ្វើឧបោសថបានបន្តិចបន្តួួច ដោយវិធីស្រាយចំណងដែលជាប់មាំ

2019 Feb 04 04:18:58
Cheav Villa: ព្រះអង្គ​ _/\_ ចិត្តនឿយណាយចន្លោះពេលបានសុខ និងបានទុក្ខ

2019 Feb 04 04:04:13
Cheav Villa:  _/\_ _/\_ _/\_ កូណាព្រះអង្គ

2019 Feb 04 03:55:36
Johann: English iti 49

2019 Feb 04 03:51:37
Johann: Importand teaching in regard of wishing for becoming or not-becoming! ទិដ្ឋិគតសូត្រ (១២.)

2019 Feb 04 03:37:57
Johann: It can be observed free of all Sakaya ditthi as well.

2019 Feb 04 03:25:52
Johann: Uposatha is a good tradition to take on.

2019 Feb 04 03:24:53
Johann: This, the Buddha told, can not be archived by just wishing, Nyom, the end of suffering.

2019 Feb 04 02:23:26
Cheav Villa: May​ all possibilities in a rebirth has decreased  _/\_ _/\_ _/\_

2019 Feb 04 02:18:49
Cheav Villa: Since my grandmother, my dad, I kana has not taken on the traditional of Chinese new year

2019 Feb 04 01:28:26
Johann: An insightful Chines New Year and new moon day, a rebirth of another round of possibility in chosing ways with every action.

2019 Feb 03 16:08:02
Ieng Puthy: ករុណាថ្វាយបង្គំុព្រះអង្គvandami 🙏🏻🙏🏻🙏🏻

2019 Feb 03 12:20:05
Cheav Villa:  កូណាព្រះអង្គ  _/\_ 

2019 Feb 03 12:10:00
Johann: Nyom Villa

2019 Feb 03 07:06:33
Johann: Nyom Buddhi

2019 Feb 02 16:53:13
Johann: All a matter of leaving house and not searching for the next, Nyom.

2019 Feb 02 16:51:36
Johann: Editing post here is not so good since there is a software issue, cutting away all to 200 characters.

2019 Feb 02 16:18:35
Ieng Puthy: ព្រះអង្គករុណានឹករលឹកភ្នំឱរា៉ល់ណាស់ សង្ឃឹមថាថ្ងៃណាមួយករុណានឹងបានទៅថ្វាយបង្គំុព្រះអង្គដោយផ្ទាល់ ។ បេីបុណ

2019 Feb 02 15:52:20
Johann: Nyom Buddhi

2019 Feb 02 15:35:54
Ieng Puthy: 🙏🏻🙏🏻🙏🏻ករុណាថ្វាយបង្គំុVandami Bhante.

2019 Feb 02 15:33:38
Ieng Puthy: 🙏🏻🙏🏻🙏🏻

2019 Feb 02 10:35:46
Cheav Villa:  _/\_ _/\_ _/\_

2019 Feb 02 08:36:16
Johann: Atma will then make a "sun-break" for today

2019 Feb 01 11:36:30
Ieng Puthy: ករុណាថ្វាយបង្គំ🙏🏻🙏🏻🙏🏻Vandami Bhante

2019 Jan 31 15:55:14
Johann: Bhante Muni

2019 Jan 30 15:40:30
Johann: Nyom Buddhi

2019 Jan 30 05:24:55
Johann: "sreng" is really "nasty" if becoming. It's also easy to get by sweeping dusty group and dry gras.

2019 Jan 30 04:35:46
Cheav Villa: កូណាព្រះអង្គ  _/\_

2019 Jan 30 04:11:18
Johann: It's possible not "sreng", Nyom, it's autumn diseas, and infection not to be healed. The origin why the Buddha allowed tonics ("food" at "wrong" time), weakness of the body.

2019 Jan 30 03:27:08
Cheav Villa:  _/\_ _/\_ _/\_

2019 Jan 30 01:12:39
Sophorn: Bhante Khemakura, kana hofft, Bhante geht es besser!  _/\_

2019 Jan 30 01:12:10
Sophorn: Vandami Bhante Khemakura  _/\_

2019 Jan 30 01:11:53
Sophorn: Vandami Bhante Indannano  _/\_

2019 Jan 30 01:11:38
Sophorn: Vandami Bhante Johann _/\_

2019 Jan 29 10:12:10
Johann: Bhante. Wie geht es der Unterlippe?

2019 Jan 27 04:59:09
Johann: Nyom Vithou

2019 Jan 26 14:38:07
Cheav Villa: Vandāmi Bhante Indaññāno  _/\_

2019 Jan 25 16:12:30
Cheav Villa:  :o _/\_

2019 Jan 25 16:04:02
Johann: There are two, actually. Something to be careful about.

2019 Jan 25 15:39:25
Cheav Villa: Vilāsa  :D karuṇā found this meaning in Pāḷi Dictionary  _/\_

2019 Jan 25 15:24:52
Johann: No vaṇṇa-macchariya: rejoicing that other appear as vilasa as oneself... Sadhu!

2019 Jan 25 15:17:51
Cheav Villa:  _/\_ _/\_ _/\_

2019 Jan 25 14:29:43
Johann: If Ñoma Buddhi likes to wear the color of an ārāmikinī, to be able to edit, add translations, corrections, it should be no problem. Ñoma Vīḷa might help to get known the "power and responsibility" of goodness.

2019 Jan 25 14:22:02
Ieng Puthy: 🙏🏼អរព្រះគុណព្រះអង្គ

2019 Jan 25 11:55:49
Johann: No problem Nyom, that was clear (word prediction...). Only moderator and admin can edit text in the shoutbox.

2019 Jan 25 11:04:42
Ieng Puthy: 🙏🏻ព្រះអង្គករុណាសរសេរអក្សរខុស ករុណារកកន្លែងលុបអក្សរដែលខុសមិនឃេីញទេ ។ ករុណាចង់សរសេរVandami Bhante មិនមែន vandalism Bhante ទេ។

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Author Topic: [Q&A] Is Nibbana 'here and now' wrong or right view?  (Read 689 times)

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Offline Johann

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[Q&A] Is Nibbana 'here and now' wrong or right view?
« on: May 01, 2018, 03:08:15 PM »
Is Nibbana 'here and now' wrong or right view?

Venerable members of the Sangha,
walking in front Fellows in leading the holly life.

 _/\_  _/\_  _/\_

In Respect of the Triple Gems, Buddha, Dhamma and Sangha, in Respect of the Elders of the community _/\_ , my person tries to answer this question. Please, may all knowledgeable Venerables and Dhammika, out of compassion, correct my person, if something is not correct and fill also graps, if something is missing.

Valued Upasaka, Upasika, Aramika(inis),
dear Readers and Visitors,

 *sgift*

Since it lead often to discussion and might be in this, or that way missunderstood.
As state as one kind of group of wrong view in, for example DN 1 , it needs to be right understood that this 'here and now'-view covers the idea of here and now, in this or that sensual world, either in the sphere of the wordilt pleasures, of in refined states of mind, in the Jhanas, connected with sensuality and a notion of "but when this self" in fine sensual, mind-object spheres. One could understand this kind of 'here and now' also as here and now in the khandhas, or here and now in nama-rupa. To find Nibbana there, such is impossible and wrong view.

This view is often held by certain Nihilistic Jhana friends, and of course also the drive of the huge Meditation-business and really not a good, since not seldom those people have no fear in wrongdoing, and neglect consquences, at the same time, having for now, a while a good trained mind of householder-equanimity.

Just look on the virtue of people, their engagements in wordily things and politic, and if tracing such elements in an Element, is actually easy to recognize grave wrong view.

BUT:

It is clear, that 'here and now' is the most accurate placement of Nibbana and in it's case has nothing more to do with view, but also being aware and believe, that Nibbana can be attained right here and now, by dropping the clinging aggregates, is of course right view.

An idea that Nibbana can only be attained in a "next world", e.g. not in this very "existence" is not supported by those having made known and realiced by themselves, here and now, the cessation of suffering.

May it help those eager after liberation and not after profiling of a sense of self and own in views.

The view, that Nibbana is only attained by the break off of the body (an aggregate already detached by an Arahat) is merely a view developed by Commentators, but yes, might be in as far the better choice, since overestimation does not have that much place to request ones assumings. On the other hand, this view has all to often lead to such foolishness like suicide.

So it's really importand to get it right and focus more on details, traceable, such as desire for being or not-being, notions of self or sensual desires.

Of(f) cause, there are also Brahm's who suggest notions like "we are right here in pure land, western world", which gives food for a lot of views, yes.

SO:

May you read, and pay close attention:

Namo tassa bhagavato arahato sammā-sambuddhassa


THE SELF’S UNBINDING IN THE HERE-&-NOW

“There are, monks, some contemplatives & brahmans who are proponents of unbinding [nibbāna] in the here-&-now, who proclaim the highest here-&-now unbinding of an existing being [sant satta][29] on five grounds. And with reference to what, coming from what, are these honorable contemplatives & brahmans proponents of unbinding in the here-&-now who proclaim the highest here-&-now unbinding of an existing being on five grounds?

58. “There is the case where a certain contemplative or brahman is of this opinion, this view: ‘When the self goes about endowed & provided with the five strings of sensuality, it’s to this extent that the self attains the highest here-&-now unbinding.’[30] This is how some proclaim the highest here-&-now unbinding of an existing being.

59. “Another says to him, ‘There is, my good man, that self of which you speak. I don’t say that there’s not. But it’s not to that extent that one attains the highest here-&-now unbinding. Why is that? Because sensuality is inconstant, stressful, subject to change. From its condition of being subject to change & becoming otherwise arises sorrow, lamentation, pain, distress, & despair. But when this self—quite secluded from sensuality, secluded from unskillful qualities—enters & remains in the first jhāna: rapture & pleasure born of seclusion, accompanied by directed thought & evaluation,[31] it’s to that extent that this self attains the highest here-&-now unbinding.’ This is how some proclaim the highest here-&-now unbinding of an existing being.

60. “Another says to him, ‘There is, my good man, that self of which you speak. I don’t say that there’s not. But it’s not to that extent that one attains the highest here-&-now unbinding. Why is that? Because precisely what’s thought or evaluated there: That’s declared to be gross. But when this self—with the stilling of directed thoughts & evaluations—enters & remains in the second jhāna: rapture & pleasure born of concentration, unification of awareness free from directed thought & evaluation, internal assurance, it’s to that extent that this self attains the highest here-&-now unbinding.’ This is how some proclaim the highest here-&-now unbinding of an existing being.

61. “Another says to him, ‘There is, my good man, that self of which you speak. I don’t say that there’s not. But it’s not to that extent that one attains the highest here-&-now unbinding. Why is that? Because precisely the state of mental exhilaration immersed in rapture there: That’s declared to be gross. But when this self, with the fading of rapture, remains equanimous, mindful, & alert, and, sensing pleasure with the body, enters & remains in the third jhāna, of which the noble ones declare, ‘Equanimous & mindful, he has a pleasant abiding,’ it’s to that extent that this self attains the highest here-&-now unbinding.’ This is how some proclaim the highest here-&-now unbinding of an existing being.

62. “Another says to him, ‘There is, my good man, that self of which you speak. I don’t say that there’s not. But it’s not to that extent that one attains the highest here-&-now unbinding. Why is that? Because precisely the mental concern with “pleasure” there: That’s declared to be gross. But when this self, with the abandoning of pleasure & pain—as with the earlier disappearance of elation & distress—enters & remains in the fourth jhāna: purity of equanimity & mindfulness, neither pleasure nor pain, it’s to that extent that this self attains the highest here-&-now unbinding.’ This is how some proclaim the highest here-&-now unbinding of an existing being.

“These, monks, are the contemplatives & brahmans who are proponents of unbinding in the here-&-now, who proclaim the highest here-&-now unbinding of an existing being on five grounds. And whatever contemplatives & brahmans who are proponents of unbinding in the here-&-now, who proclaim the highest here-&-now unbinding of an existing being, they all do so on one or another of these five grounds. There is nothing outside of this.

“With regard to this, the Tathāgata discerns that ‘These standpoints, thus seized, thus grasped at, lead to such & such a destination, to such & such a state in the world beyond.’ That the Tathāgata discerns. And he discerns what is higher than that. And yet, discerning that, he does not grasp at it. And as he is not grasping at it, unbinding [nibbuti] is experienced right within. Knowing, as they have come to be, the origination, ending, allure, & drawbacks of feelings, along with the escape from feelings, the Tathāgata, monks—through lack of clinging/sustenance—is released.

“These, monks, are the dhammas—deep, hard to see, hard to realize, tranquil, refined, beyond the scope of conjecture, subtle, to-be-experienced by the wise—that the Tathāgata proclaims, having directly known & realized them for himself, and that those who, rightly speaking in praise of the Tathāgata in line with what is factual, would speak.

And don't think, stinginess not a little abounded for now, that you even have attained any Jhana, not to speak of paths or fruits. In this envy and stinginess, you might not even find certain ideas of believing your world around being, even all sensual pleasures, Nibbana. No way without leaving home and stinginess first, developed based on gratitude.

Anumodana.
« Last Edit: May 01, 2018, 03:23:15 PM by Johann »
This post and Content has come to be by Dhamma-Dana and so is given as it       Dhamma-Dana: Johann

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