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[Buddha]

Author Topic: Is smoking tobacco/ e-ciggarettes a breach of the 5th precept?  (Read 67 times)

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Online Johann

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  • Date of ordination/Datum der Ordination.: 20140527

I have read on this forum (DW) that smoking tobacco ciggarettes is not a breach of the 5th precept. Others disagree.

Is smoking tobacco a breach of the 5th precept or not?

How about e-ciggarettes (vaping)?

Quote from: Johann
No, not at all. The fifth precept encouragesgis abstaining from means which causing heedlessness, better lose of fear and let one easier perform kammic bad deeds (e.g. the 4 precepts) as well as acting without restrain.

Even if still after certain sensual-satisfaction: If all people in the world would be just addicted to this, less wars, harming, destruction and all other painful things would be present out of desire after sensuality. Not even plant-life would be needed to destroy for such.
It's even allowed for Bhikkhus incl. a lot of allowances tools and storage equipment, yet of course not for simple sensual enjoyment.

In relation of such as e-ciggarettes, in regard of precept on it's own, propably not (not really knowing them, of what it is), but thought of how they are produced, etc... they might cause a lot of harm for others.

Protrest out of common thoughts and daily wellness argumentation:

Quote from: Padipa
Intoxicants are not allowed--period: hard to believe this can be debated. Nicotine affects the mind's chemical transmissions, is highly addictive and is, therefore, an intoxicant. The traversing of the path (magga) for objective reality through purification (pariyodapana) of ones own mind (sacitta), via ones own mind, is difficult enough! Why introduce chemical variables which promote conditioning, false states of awareness, and jam the brain's synapses?

If you are going to do this, why come here to defend it?

Quote from: Johann
In deed, hard to see ones intentions, hard to overcome certain views and aversion...

One who acts simply to justify ones short comings, spocken of sacca, is really a bad fool. Now not able to leave the mass of house behind to probably be able to get on the path, indoxicated by youth, health and life, isn't it not that hypocratical clincing to rites and virtues not conductive on the path, are what hinders?

Again, smoking tabacco causes not to lose restrain from evil deeds and this matches the topic, this is a matter relevant for lasting benefit. Of what those clincing to house may see as days trendy means to run after, thats not grasped by it, for this is at most a defending of addiction to the three intoxications youth, health and life: marked, feel-good-selling and wellness-politic. So just mentioned for those seeking something beyond views at least, sticking to conductive for gaining it.

And to get it not wrong, smoking is not a path-factor and may effect ones health unnecessary. So don't start doing it, or praise it improper.

A common argumentation out of improper attention:

Quote from: Nyom Laurence
Quote from: Johann
Again, smoking tabacco causes not to lose restrain from evil deeds
I think this is up for debate. I've been addicted to cigarettes in the past and I can tell you that at the point of trying to quit, but still feeling cravings, I would likely have taken a cigarette that wasn't given to me if someone had left a pack behind or something. I also became extremely quick to anger whilst craving cigarettes, if I was of a different temperament I may have acted on this too...

Whilst you are actually smoking tobacco, I agree that there is not much of an effect, although if a non-smoker had a cigarette right now they would have a head rush that would almost certainly feel like quite a big effect. The addictive nature of tobacco, however could easily cause one to slip into evil deeds.

If this way of thinking is valid in relation of Silas, then loving your wife and you children, association with them, would be a breach of the basic precepts as well. Chocolate, favor for tee in the morning, favor to sit in this or that way... No to speak of having a favor to think about yourself...

It may happen, that one deprived of his honey (tobacco) may to unwise things, yes. Stealing, lying, even killing could possible happen.
But in this case, if such is the base of argument, there are countless other sensual desires, like beloved, who are much more and frequently cause of conflicts. That's running out to the common opinion-battle and daily changing views.

Beings are strong addicted to the objects of the sense, cetain food and food (entertainment) is required to overcome addition to food.

So that is not a good way of thinking at the beginning. Althought food for lifting oneself over others, yet still addicted to everyting, caught in home/house. Yet, of cause, all kinds of sensual desire lead to suffering and it's because of sensual desire that people take knives, lead wars...

On a higher level, if we take the factor of precepts on a high meditative level, what ever enjoying and grasping of sign, sound, taste... all of this is a thief, taking of what is not yours.

Step by step means that one let go of desire after sensual pleasure which causes harm. And as told before, it the worlds beings would be just addicted to tobacco strongly and nothing else, there would be less suffering caused, much lesser.

So all this biased and opinion-forcing arguments are really no match at all.

Most beloved are those driving cars, wishing and addicted to so many things causing so much burning and sick all around, arguing for "smoking effects the health of others..." One could possible smoke 20 pack a day and would not nearly harm as much as an confused activist driving his care, turning on his AC... what ever.

No match and arguments on the level of basic Silas and harm.

May it be of use to do not lose the track, proper attention and help to find the path beyond any desire for what ever refined, harmless and as real taken food.

Usually people giving up one not so good habit will take on a bunch of others for entertaining the mind with sensuality. So the proper way is to simply try honestly keeping basic precepts and get not drunken, indoxicated, losing track by losing right view "there is given, sacrifice".

If smoking tobacco is ones last addition, having heard the good Dhamma, fond firm faith, understanding or having even seen by him/herself, he/she will be sure to end up minimum as Once-returner in this very life, since he will face the first Noble truth in relation of sensuality certainly. No need to fear the sublime destination of a tobacco using person with right view.

Foolish and in most cases corrupted informed who has the thought that a Noble person is not to be found under those using tobacco, yet it might be of cause that a not outsider dwells heedless as well.

To understand this matter, even there would be some using tobacco for certain enjoyment, it's good to read Nandiya Sutta: To Nandiya .
This post and Content has come to be by Dhamma-Dana and so is given as it       Dhamma-Dana: Johann

Offline Cheav Villa

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Re: Is smoking tobacco/ e-ciggarettes a breach of the 5th precept?
« Reply #1 on: November 09, 2018, 03:40:13 PM »
  _/\_


Tags:
 

Plauderbox

 

Johann

November 11, 2018, 01:00:38 AM
Sadhu Nyom. "May the Dhamma of the Buddha, and those following, be all beings refuge for a blessed life and beyond."
 

Mohan Gnanathilake

November 11, 2018, 12:31:09 AM
May the Dhamma be the greatest blessing in our lives today!
 

Mohan Gnanathilake

November 11, 2018, 12:30:17 AM
Möge heute das Dhamma der größte Segen in unserem Leben sein!
 

Johann

November 10, 2018, 03:31:36 AM
Sadhu! "May all given the right causes so that they experiance peace, prospery, friendships in their worlds today."
 

Mohan Gnanathilake

November 10, 2018, 02:42:15 AM
Sehr ehrwürdiger Samanera Johann,
hier gibt es einen Fehler. Nicht Mӧge, sondern Mӧgen.

Dhamma Grüβe an Sie aus Sri Lanka!
 

Mohan Gnanathilake

November 10, 2018, 12:58:57 AM
May peace, prosperity, Friendship prevail throughout the word today!
 

Mohan Gnanathilake

November 10, 2018, 12:58:26 AM
Mӧge heute Frieden, Wohlstand und Freundschaft auf der ganzen Welt herrschen!
 

Johann

November 08, 2018, 01:40:21 AM
May all those having not observed the new-moon Uposata yesterday take the chance of this day.
 

Johann

November 07, 2018, 01:52:42 AM
Sadhu! "May I, may all, give the causes, act in way, that I, that all, experiance a blissfull day."
 

Mohan Gnanathilake

November 07, 2018, 12:36:19 AM
May today be a blissful day!
 

Mohan Gnanathilake

November 07, 2018, 12:35:13 AM
Mӧge der heutige Tag ein glückseliger Tag sein!
 

Cheav Villa

November 06, 2018, 02:57:08 PM
Sandhu!
 

Johann

November 06, 2018, 12:41:22 AM
Sadhu. "May I, may all, use this day to give themselves causes for long lasting happines."
 

Mohan Gnanathilake

November 06, 2018, 12:17:34 AM
May today be a meritful and meritorious day!
 

Mohan Gnanathilake

November 06, 2018, 12:16:58 AM
Mӧge der heutige Tag ein verdienstvoller und verdienstlicher Tag sein!
 

Johann

November 05, 2018, 09:16:58 AM
Sadhu
 

Mohan Gnanathilake

November 05, 2018, 01:41:57 AM
May today be a day of insight!                                                                        
 

Mohan Gnanathilake

November 05, 2018, 01:41:24 AM
Mӧge der heutige Tag ein Tag der Einsicht sein!
 

Johann

November 04, 2018, 04:57:53 PM
(I, Breah Karuna, will try to send the pictures tomorrow again, because today the sending does not work)

No problem Nyom. គ្មានបញ្ហាទេញោម
 

Cheav Villa

November 04, 2018, 04:09:20 PM
ខ្ញុំព្រះករុណានឹងផ្ញេីរូបភាពនៅថ្ងៃស្អែកទៀត ព្រោះឥលូវផ្ញេីមិនទៅទេព្រះអង្គ
 

Johann

November 04, 2018, 07:58:41 AM
Sadhu
 

Mohan Gnanathilake

November 04, 2018, 02:45:36 AM
Dear The Most Reverend Samanera Johann,

I wish you a devotional day.

Dhamma Greetings from Sri Lanka!


 

Mohan Gnanathilake

November 03, 2018, 03:11:53 PM
Dear The Most Reverend Samanera Johann,

I thank you for your kind service.

Dhamma Greetings from Sri Lanka!


 

Cheav Villa

November 03, 2018, 02:03:55 PM
ព្រះករុណាព្រះអង្គ
 

Johann

November 03, 2018, 02:01:26 PM
(I would like to inform Breah Ang, that I, Breah Karuna, together with my husband/family, and older Sister Sophoeun will go to Aural tomorow in the morning. May Breah Ang be told to (a)wait.)

May you have a secure and hurry-less travel and meet good fortune all along the way. May you drive slowly
 

Cheav Villa

November 03, 2018, 12:51:48 PM
សូមទូលព្រះអង្គ​ ខ្ញុំព្រះករុណានិងគ្រួសារ និងបងស្រីសុភឿននឹងទៅឱរ៉ាល់នាព្រឹកស្អែក សូមទូលនិមន្តព្រះអង្គចាំ
 

Mohan Gnanathilake

November 03, 2018, 12:06:08 PM
Dear The Most Reverend Samanera Johann,

I have put the link on the correct place. Please confirm if it is correct!

Dhamma Greetings from Sri Lanka!
 

Johann

November 03, 2018, 10:42:58 AM
Nyom Villa.
 

Johann

November 03, 2018, 10:42:08 AM
And Atma should put it on a good place? Take your time. Nobody can do your work, merits for Nyom Mohan aside he himself.
 

Mohan Gnanathilake

November 03, 2018, 07:27:06 AM
Dear The Most Reverend Samanera Johann,

Since I do not have much time, I would like to submit the following link.

Dhamma Greetings from Sri Lanka!





 

Johann

November 03, 2018, 07:25:21 AM
Nyom Mohan
 

Johann

November 02, 2018, 01:26:07 PM
Better in Topic itself, Nyom. See here .
 

Cheav Villa

November 02, 2018, 12:53:59 PM
ខ្ញុំ​កូណាមិនយល់ពីពាក្យរបស់ព្រះអង្គទេ
My sleep, my health, my many household, feelings, rememberance, projects, recognitions ... "I want to have time when I'm old and sick ... surely! សូម ព្រះអង្គ ជួ
 

Johann

November 02, 2018, 12:20:25 PM
No problems or demands at all Nyom Villa. All fine for Nyom, there where she is?
 

Cheav Villa

November 02, 2018, 12:17:21 PM
My sleep, my health, my many household, feelings, rememberance, projects, recognitions ... "I want to have time when I am old and sick ... surely! សូមព្រះអង្គជួយពន្យល់ផង
 

Cheav Villa

November 02, 2018, 12:13:05 PM
 :o ខ្ញុំកូណាមេីលច្រលំទៀតហេីយ សូមទោសព្រះអង្គម្តងទៀត  :D
 

Cheav Villa

November 02, 2018, 11:26:23 AM
ខ្ញុំកូណាសូមទោសមិនបានឆ្លីយតបព្រះអង្គ ទាន់ពេលទេីបតែងាកឃេីញ។ ខ្ញុំកូណាចង់ជួយធុងទឹក និងបេីអាចនិងបុកអណ្តូង
 

Johann

November 01, 2018, 10:05:29 AM
May all have/hold an auspicious Uposatha-Sila-Observance day.
 

Johann

October 31, 2018, 03:14:35 PM
"Oh! My sleep, my health, my many household, feelings, rememberance, projects, recognitions...", I will have time when I am old and sick... surely!
 

Johann

October 31, 2018, 03:09:31 PM
in earlier times "Buddhist" would come the day before Sila-day to the monastery and, not going to sleep, after having taken 8 precepts, do 24h merits. "good old times..."  :)
 

Johann

October 31, 2018, 01:50:41 PM
 :) lost... "Zeit hat man nicht, die muß man sich nehmen"
 

Mohan Gnanathilake

October 31, 2018, 01:43:14 PM
Dear The Most Reverend Samanera Johann,

I agree with you. But I need more time.

Dhamma Greetings from Sri Lanka!
 

Johann

October 31, 2018, 01:25:52 PM
Thinking "in the future" is another lost battle... Nyom: Sieg! . Next minute you could die and what follows Nyom?
 

Johann

October 31, 2018, 01:22:24 PM
Similar to this one, maybe: [Khmer] Anreden, Begrüßung | Forms of adress, Greeting , started as layperson by now Bhante Khemakumara.
 

Mohan Gnanathilake

October 31, 2018, 01:17:50 PM
Dear The Most Reverend Samanera Johann,

In the future, I will try my best.

Dhamma Greetings from Sri Lanka!
Mohan Barathi Gnanathilake




 

Johann

October 31, 2018, 01:16:37 PM
Where ever people stop to make merits, don't rejoice with it, it will not need long that revolution-desires arise, having gone out of puñña
 

Johann

October 31, 2018, 01:11:17 PM
What about teaching ways of introduction abhivadana, and how to adress monks, behave, speak in monasteries? That would be great in many aspects for Nyom.
 

Johann

October 31, 2018, 01:08:34 PM
Nyom could teach a little Sinhalese, and open a topic. At least such, by thinking and giving into the Sublime Sangha would be of great benefit for Nyom. Not ease to find possibility to make merits, yet surely devotion is also one.
 

Mohan Gnanathilake

October 31, 2018, 12:59:52 PM
Sehr ehrwürdiger Samanera Johann,

Dhamma Grüβe an Sie aus Sri Lanka!

Mohan Barathi Gnanathilake





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