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Note: This talk on a question outside has come into being in realtion with "Weise tadeln oder nicht? Und was Buddha dazu ermahnte.

[[Q&A] (Is) "Attacking" others with words such as they are weapons (noble?)

Attacking others with words such as they are weapons


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Reference needed. I remember reading a sutta where Buddha mentioned something like a stream enterer would no longer use words to attack others like weapons. I would like to read that sutta in its entirety again. Thanks.

Venerable members of the Sangha,
walking in front Fellows in leading the holly life.

 _/\_  _/\_  _/\_

In Respect of the Triple Gems, Buddha, Dhamma and Sangha, in Respect of the Elders of the community _/\_ , my person tries to answer this question. Please, may all knowledgeable Venerables and Dhammika, out of compassion, correct my person, if something is not correct and fill also graps, if something is missing.

Valued Upasaka, Upasika, Aramika(inis),
dear Readers and Visitors,

 *sgift*

(This is a maybe modified and expanded answer of the "original" - which also could have been changed by third person - that can be found here . )


- Namo tassa bhagavato arahato sammā-sambuddhassa -

Homage to the Blessed One, the Worthy One, the Rightly Self-awakened One.



There are already good answers (as for a part of the question, and not thought about the intent of the question), Nyom Dean, but we need to be careful to take this answers not as a weapon against those who deedly compassioned like to cut away our defilements which are claiming the talked in this Suttas by hard when they are attacted as means to let them survive. Many take the Dhamma as weapon against the three juwels and so was it even in the Buddhas time:
 

Namo tassa bhagavato arahato sammā-sambuddhassa


..."Come now, prince. Go to Gotama the contemplative and on arrival say this: 'Lord, would the Tathagata say words that are unendearing & disagreeable to others?' If Gotama the contemplative, thus asked, answers, 'The Tathagata would say words that are unendearing & disagreeable to others,' then you should say, 'Then how is there any difference between you, lord, and run-of-the-mill people? For even run-of-the-mill people say words that are unendearing & disagreeable to others.' But if Gotama the contemplative, thus asked, answers, 'The Tathagata would not say words that are unendearing & disagreeable to others,' then you should say, 'Then how, lord, did you say of Devadatta that "Devadatta is headed for destitution, Devadatta is headed for hell, Devadatta will boil for an eon, Devadatta is incurable"? For Devadatta was upset & disgruntled at those words of yours.' When Gotama the contemplative is asked this two-pronged question by you, he won't be able to swallow it down or spit it up. Just as if a two-horned chestnut[1] were stuck in a man's throat: he would not be able to swallow it down or spit it up. In the same way, when Gotama the contemplative is asked this two-pronged question by you, he won't be able to swallow it down or spit it up."... read the whole about right Speech

The Buddha, like all other good teacher, are actually very skilled in use there weapon and there are many stories where they "brought" the "opposer" on the floor, "won over him" made his defilements neutal and even dis-manteled him in front of a big group, but not for any gain or to higher themselves, but to bring him in a situation where he can be talked the Dhamma, has no change to escape, or like in cases like in the above sutta, to bring his disciples again on the lain (or speak to them clear that somebody acts wrong).

A good sample in regard of one of the many fights we find in the teachings is: Cula-Saccaka Sutta: The Shorter Discourse to Saccaka

Many of the Suttas in MN may offer to see that it is not the most skillful to lay down the sword of skilled speech but show like in AN 4.100 , that equanimity is not the highes skill:
 

- Namo tassa bhagavato arahato sammā-sambuddhassa -


"There are, Master Gotama, those four kinds of persons found existing in the world. Of those four, the one that seems to me the most excellent and sublime is the one who speaks dispraise of someone who deserves dispraise, and the dispraise is accurate, truthful, and timely; and who also speaks praise of someone who deserves praise, and the praise is accurate, truthful, and timely. For what reason? Because what excels, Master Gotama, is knowledge of the proper time to speak in any particular case.

(proper time is when possible and nessesary, sometimes also "just" for others if the certain doer is not capable to take.)

So to give the answer, "Does a stream-enter still uses the weapon of speech", the last Sutta and the samples of Buddha, his disciples, till good teachers of today, will show: "Yes (if wishing) he/she will use the weapon of even strong speech (yet still not with word of fools an outcasts), but not for gain, not to harm and simply out of compassion, less are able to receive.", and if a stream enter would have use it in affect in a wrong way (with akusala mind), maybe as defense (never for intended gain!), as a break of good conduct, he would suddenly confess his wrong doing. So it might aslo happen that a Noble One uses not nice word wrongly.

It's good to do not just pick up certain things from the teachings and use it as weapon. Most Dhamma-Dealer (those who make a livelihood in teaching, or gain, claim and sometimes even provide no defilement-cutting of speech, "peaceful, not opposing speech, ever lovely speech", because the costumers and fans like that, or better their defilements and so they are able to make more gain while simply slander and harm the Dhamma and lead people to fools. Why? Because what counts is the truth and not artifacted peace for nobodies benefit.

Take care to do not use this weapon Dhamma to kill youself off. That goes quick if grasping the head of the snake, walk a way of demand peace and metta (yet on fight and aversive your self), and if not willing to put oneself under good authority, its hard to get the right way.

Hope that this - surely at first - unpleasant answer reaches the worriors and warriors at the right time before theiy cut them off with an haft and incomplete weapon and reason to fight.

Many think "Oh I Won." Having make a visible strike. But the cut of the other war's so sharp that they still do not realice that the head has been seperated already and it's just a matter of time that he will fall down."
 

- Namo tassa bhagavato arahato sammā-sambuddhassa -


[1] In the case of words that the Tathagata knows to be unfactual, untrue, unbeneficial (or: not connected with the goal), unendearing & disagreeable to others, he does not say them.

[2] In the case of words that the Tathagata knows to be factual, true, unbeneficial, unendearing & disagreeable to others, he does not say them.

[3] In the case of words that the Tathagata knows to be factual, true, beneficial, but unendearing & disagreeable to others, he has a sense of the proper time for saying them.

[4] In the case of words that the Tathagata knows to be unfactual, untrue, unbeneficial, but endearing & agreeable to others, he does not say them.

[5] In the case of words that the Tathagata knows to be factual, true, unbeneficial, but endearing & agreeable to others, he does not say them.

[6] In the case of words that the Tathagata knows to be factual, true, beneficial, and endearing & agreeable to others, he has a sense of the proper time for saying them. Why is that? Because the Tathagata has sympathy for living beings."

What do you think? Is this a sample of a Monk you harms you? Heavily harmed your defilements? And/Or sharp words to stay on track and to keep you from serious wrongdoing? Deeply compassioned with some good wisdom, or the act of a fool? Think good and wise about it and its up to the wisdom of the receiver if a gift is taken or rejected. Meaning at least, only a Noble One would recognice another with secure. Just one who had seen will know if a reminder is right. Other need to think, test, observe and bring it to have seen by my self fist or have deep faith.


Anumodana!

2
Appamāda - What is it? How to practise it? Benefits?

Quote from:
Appamāda - What is it? How to practise it? Benefits?


In this video , Ven. Yuttadhammo Bhikkhu says that the whole of the Buddhist teachings could be summarized as Appamāda (heedfulness), at the risk of oversimplification.

In the Mahaparinibbana Sutta (DN16) , the Buddha conveyed the last message of his life:

 

- Namo tassa bhagavato arahato sammā-sambuddhassa -

Then the Blessed One addressed the monks, "Now, then, monks, I exhort you: All fabrications are subject to decay. Bring about completion by being heedful." Those were the Tathagata's last words.

According to the Appamāda Sutta (SN3.17):
 

- Namo tassa bhagavato arahato sammā-sambuddhassa -

"There is one quality, great king, that keeps both kinds of benefit secure — benefits in this life & benefits in lives to come."

"But what, lord, is that one quality...?"

"Heedfulness, great king. Just as the footprints of all living beings with legs can be encompassed by the footprint of the elephant, and the elephant's footprint is declared to be supreme among them in terms of its great size; in the same way, heedfulness is the one quality that keeps both kinds of benefit secure — benefits in this life & benefits in lives to come."

Questions:
  • What really is Appamāda (heedfulness)?
  • How does one practise Appamāda (heedfulness)?
  • What are the benefits of Appamāda (heedfulness)?
  • Why is this one of the most important concepts in Buddhism, that the Buddha chose this to be his last message?
  • What is the relationship between Appamāda (heedfulness) and mindfulness? This answer equates the two.


 

Venerable members of the Sangha,
walking in front Fellows in leading the holly life.

 _/\_  _/\_  _/\_

In Respect of the Triple Gems, Buddha, Dhamma and Sangha, in Respect of the Elders of the community _/\_ , my person tries to answer this question. Please, may all knowledgeable Venerables and Dhammika, out of compassion, correct my person, if something is not correct and fill also graps, if something is missing.

Valued Upasaka, Upasika, Aramika(inis),
dear Readers and Visitors,

 *sgift*

(This is a maybe modified and expanded answer of the "original" - which also could have been changed by third person - that can be found here . )


- Namo tassa bhagavato arahato sammā-sambuddhassa -

Homage to the Blessed One, the Worthy One, the Rightly Self-awakened One.


Nyom Ruben,

There are good answers allready, by Nyom Andre and Dhammadathu.

My person guesses the greatest problem with all this and the reason why the Buddha pointed on it as his last gift, is that it is most serious. We might know all the good ways, yet we waste our time in talking and teaching others, or by endless asking, while we for ourself don't listen (doning the talk) and actually stay pamāda, conscienceless, unprincipled, unscrupulous (touse better and more urging translations), meaning, still causing us and others harm, rather to simply walk the way for benefit for all.

Nothing is solved and won by talking and dreaming.

Being conscienceless means to forget or deny the three Governing prinziples, the Self, the world, the Dhamma: Adhipateyya Sutta: Governing Principles

My person likes to add the story about one of Buddhas conscienceless disciple here:

 

Namo tassa bhagavato arahato sammā-sambuddhassa


While residing at the Jetavana monastery, the Buddha uttered Verse (282) of this book, with reference to Thera Potthila.

Potthila was a senior bhikkhu who knew the Pitaka well and was actually teaching the Dhamma to five hundred bhikkhus. Because he knew the Pitaka, he was also very conceited. The Buddha knew his weakness and wanted him to mend his ways and put him on the right path. So, whenever Potthila came to pay obeisance, the Buddha would address him as 'Useless Potthila'. When Potthila heard these remarks, he pondered over those words of the Buddha and came to realize that the Buddha had made those unkind remarks because he, Potthila, had not made any serious effort to practise meditation and had not achieved any of the Maggas or even any level of mental absorption (jhana).

Thus, without telling anyone Thera Potthila left for a monastery at a place twenty yojanas away from the Jetavana monastery. At that monastery there were thirty bhikkhus. First, he went to the most senior bhikkhu and humbly requested him to be his mentor; but the thera, wishing to humble him, asked him to go to the next senior bhikkhu, who in his turn sent him on to the next. In this way, he was sent from one to the other until he came to a seven year old arahat samanera. The young samanera accepted him as a pupil only after ascertaining that Potthila would obediently follow his instructions. As instructed by the samanera, Thera Potthila kept his mind firmly fixed on the true nature of the body; he was very ardent and vigilant in his meditation (yoga: actually work the path, putting on self under the yoke,not just meditation, the whole path).

The Buddha saw Potthila in his vision and through supernormal power made Potthila feel his presence and encouraged him to be steadfast and ardent.

Then the Buddha spoke in verse as follows:

Verse 282: Indeed, wisdom is born of meditation (yoga: work, doing); without meditation (yoga: actually work) wisdom is lost. Knowing this twofold path of gain and loss of wisdom, one should conduct oneself so that wisdom may increase. At the end of the discourse Potthila attained arahatship.

The Buddha didn't wanted his disciples, his followers, his heritage not to become a theater of actually worthless people - just think on the culter of the Brahmans he opposed, a folk of people who just talk and do not change things for them and the world for a better, and that is why his teachings and talks are actually contain more urging to be heedful than to explain the path, because the Dhamma it self is very simple and understood fast, simplier as our strategies to stay conscienceless.

At least my person leaves a wonderful talk by Bhante Thanissaro behind:
 
Quote
The Practice in a Word , by Thanissaro Bhikkhu (1999; 3pp./8KB) Appamadena sampadetha! — such was the dying Buddha's parting instruction, which has often been translated as "Practice diligently!" But a wider reading in the suttas reveals that that crucial word appamada has a far more nuanced and significant meaning. According to the author, the Buddha's real message was, "Don't be complacent. Watch out for danger. Protect the mind's good qualities. Don't let your guard down."

May it lead to conscience and having a sense of urgency!

How to keep urgency upright, practice that it stays on top? The Buddha gave all followers, monastics and lay people one reflection the should do: on death: Here the teachings of a merely unknown serious warrior: Maraṇasati – recollection of death

Urging to conscience is the most compassionate act, at least because the urged often is not happy with it and some would agrue why one uges others. Because he/she knows that forgetting cause end effect or to do not know the effects of deeds lead to much suffering. Many also believe that the Buddha didn't urge unrequested, but he did, and also his monks had often compassion and went to householders and urged them. Here torward the Brahman Tigerprank:

 

Namo tassa bhagavato arahato sammā-sambuddhassa


On arrival, he exchanged courteous greetings with Ven. Sariputta and — after an exchange of friendly greetings & courtesies — sat to one side. As he was sitting there, Ven. Sariputta said to him, "I trust, Dhanañjani, that you are heedful?"

"From where would we get any heedfulness, master? — when parents are to be supported, wife & children are to be supported, slaves & workers are to be supported, friend-&-companion duties are to be done for friends & companions, kinsmen-&-relative duties for kinsmen & relatives, guest duties for guests, departed-ancestor duties for departed ancestors, devata duties for devatas, king duties for the king, and this body also has to be refreshed & nourished."

"What do you think Dhanañjani? There is the case where a certain person, for the sake of his mother & father, does what is unrighteous, does what is discordant. Then, because of his unrighteous, discordant behavior, hell-wardens drag him off to hell. Would he gain anything by saying, 'I did what is unrighteous, what is discordant, for the sake of my mother & father. Don't [throw] me into hell, hell-wardens!' Or would his mother & father gain anything for him by saying, 'He did what is unrighteous, what is discordant, for our sake. Don't [throw] him into hell, hell-wardens!'?"

"No, master Sariputta. Even right while he was wailing, they'd cast him into hell."

"What do you think Dhanañjani? There is the case where a certain person, for the sake of his wife & children ... his slaves & workers ... his friends & companions ... his kinsmen & relatives ... his guests ... his departed ancestors ... the devatas ... the king, does what is unrighteous, does what is discordant. Then, because of his unrighteous, discordant behavior, hell-wardens drag him off to hell. Would he gain anything by saying, 'I did what is unrighteous, what is discordant, for the sake of the king. Don't [throw] me into hell, hell-wardens!' Or would the king gain anything for him by saying, 'He did what is unrighteous, what is discordant, for our sake. Don't [throw] him into hell, hell-wardens!'?"

"No, master Sariputta. Even right while he was wailing, they'd cast him into hell."

"What do you think Dhanañjani? There is the case where a certain person, for the sake of refreshing & nourishing his body, does what is unrighteous, does what is discordant. Then, because of his unrighteous, discordant behavior, hell-wardens drag him off to hell. Would he gain anything by saying, 'I did what is unrighteous, what is discordant, for the sake of refreshing & nourishing my body. Don't [throw] me into hell, hell-wardens!' Or would others gain anything for him by saying, 'He did what is unrighteous, what is discordant, for the sake of refreshing & nourishing his body. Don't [throw] him into hell, hell-wardens!'?"

"No, master Sariputta. Even right while he was wailing, they'd cast him into hell."

"Now, what do you think, Dhanañjani? Which is the better: one who, for the sake of his mother & father, would do what is unrighteous, what is discordant; or one who, for the sake of his mother & father, would do what is righteous, what is concordant?

"Master Sariputta, the one who, for the sake of his mother & father, would do what is unrighteous, what is discordant, is not the better one. The one who, for the sake of his mother & father, would do what is righteous, what is concordant would be the better one there. Righteous behavior, concordant behavior, is better than unrighteous behavior, discordant behavior.[2]

"Dhanañjani, there are other activities — reasonable, righteous — by which one can support one's mother & father, and at the same time both not do evil and practice the practice of merit.

"What do you think, Dhanañjani: Which is the better: one who, for the sake of his wife & children ... his slaves & workers ... his friends & companions ... his kinsmen & relatives ... his guests ... his departed ancestors ... the devatas ... the king ... refreshing & nourishing his body, would do what is unrighteous, what is discordant; or one who, for the sake of refreshing & nourishing his body, would do what is righteous, what is concordant?

"Master Sariputta, the one who, for the sake of refreshing & nourishing his body, would do what is unrighteous, what is discordant, is not the better one. The one who, for the sake of refreshing & nourishing his body, would do what is righteous, what is concordant would be the better one there. Righteous behavior, concordant behavior, is better than unrighteous behavior, discordant behavior.[3]

"Dhanañjani, there are other activities — reasonable, righteous — by which one can refresh & nourish one's body, and at the same time both not do evil and practice the practice of merit."

There is no reason for not and all reason for doing merits, but how far behind knowing that and teach that are you? Doing generous deeds, giving food, clothers, shelter, medicin at proper time? No. Keeping Silas serious? No. Make your duties? No. When teaching or learning, you do it for liberation? No, for gain.

But all that knowlegde, you might be able to cite all texts, what value does it have? Non, because it just like matterial wealth and you can lose it even in an hour, lates with death. You waste another live an at the end your merits, you goodeness are gone and nothing archived and no merits made.

All this learning has only one purpose, to gain enought faith to actually do the talk.

The is a reflection which is usally one of the first when becomming a monk, but good if one is able to reflect it, even if still a housholder, in Sri Lanka it is inkl. in the "House-bible" keep by lay followers usually, not called out of reason "The Book of Protection ":
 

Namo tassa bhagavato arahato sammā-sambuddhassa


Discourse on the Ten Dhammas (Dasa-dhamma sutta [1])
Thus have I heard:

On one occasion the Blessed One was living near Savatthi at Jetavana at the monastery of Anathapindika.

Then the Blessed One addressed the monks, saying: "Monks." — "Venerable Sir," they said by way of reply. The Blessed One then spoke as follows:

"These ten essentials (dhammas) must be reflected upon again and again by one who has gone forth (to live the holy life). What are these ten?
  • "'I am now changed into a different mode of life (from that of a layman).' This must be reflected upon again and again by one who has gone forth.
  • "'My life depends on others.' This must be reflected upon again and again by one who has gone forth.
  • "'I must now behave in a different manner.' This must be reflected upon again and again by one who has gone forth.
  • "'Does my mind upbraid me regarding the state of my virtue (sila)?' This must be reflected upon again and again by one who has gone forth.
  • "'Do my discerning fellow-monks having tested me, reproach me regarding the state of my virtue?' This must be reflected upon again and again by one who has gone forth.
  • "'There will be a parting (some day) from all those who are dear and loving to me. Death brings this separation to me.' This must be reflected upon again and again by one who has gone forth.
  • "'Of kamma[2] I am constituted. Kamma is my inheritance; kamma is the matrix; kamma is my kinsman; kamma is my refuge. Whatever kamma I perform, be it good or bad, to that I shall be heir.' This must be reflected upon again and again by one who has gone forth.
  • "'How do I spend my nights and days?' This must be reflected upon again and again by one who has gone forth.
  • "'Do I take delight in solitude?' This must be reflected upon again and again by one who has gone forth.
  • "'Have I gained superhuman faculties? Have I gained that higher wisdom so that when I am questioned (on this point) by fellow-monks at the last moment (when death is approaching) I will have no occasion to be depressed and downcast?' This must be reflected upon again and again by one who has gone forth.

"These, monks, are the essentials that should be reflected again and again by one who has gone forth (to live the holy life)."

So spoke the Blessed One. Those monks rejoiced at the words of the Blessed One.

And what is needed to be and stay conscience? Conscience. That is only archived by right View at first place, especialy the 1. Noble Truth and the backwards of all consciencelessness.

And how to put it into action? By being mindfull, remembering and keeping in mind and focus primarily on the frames of reference in all deeds, all times. Knowing the body, knowing the feelings, knowing the mind, knowing the phenomenas, all when arising, being present, decay. One who is mindful, one how practice mindfulness on the four frames of reference is a person that is conscience. Don't think that a person just siting in meditation is conscience. That is not for sure. But a person that does not seek after liberation, after archiving path and fruits, is a person of heedlessness, as well a person who does not know and ask for the way, askes people who have not archived anything aside knowing. Why?

Namo tassa bhagavato arahato sammā-sambuddhassa

Cunda, it is impossible that one who is himself sunk in the mire[23] should pull out another who is sunk in the mire. But it is possible, Cunda, that one not sunk in the mire himself should pull out another who is sunk in the mire.

"It is not possible, Cunda, that one who is himself not restrained, not disciplined and not quenched [as to his passions],[24] should make others restrained and disciplined, should make them attain to the full quenching [of passions].[25] But it is possible, Cunda, that one who is himself restrained, disciplined and fully quenched [as to his passions] should make others restrained and disciplined, should make them attain to the full quenching [of passions]. Even so, Cunda... >
Quote from:
from MN8

And that's why you are lost without admirable friends, assosiating with fools or having just words and books. Because there is nobody watching you, taking benefical care and show you you heedless points, urge you to do good and blame you when tending to Mara and unbenefical. So if whe take heedfullness on the point where it starts is looking and assosiating with admirable friends the prerequisite to learn and do the whole path, to awakening. Don't be conscienceless and assosiate with friends in disguise just because they are similar or even more worth than you and your defilment (greed, aversion, notknowing, fear) rejoice with it, or you share the same preference of food and hobby together.

This talk would not find an end and to explain it was all the Buddhas and Noble Ones did since they really knew what they are talking about, so do it, the taught, at least out of gratitude in advanced so that you might say soon: "Awakened. The tasks is done, the heritage of the Buddha fullfilled, nothing further for this world."

Appamadena sampadetha! It's urgend also here! Learning is not even the half, but needs to be put in action and you can do it as well when learning, with mind, speech and body.

My Person spoke much about it ;-) mind it!
3
Zugang zur Einsicht - [Access to Insight] / Saṅkhitt'ovād: Exhortations in Brief
« Last post by Johann on August 18, 2017, 03:06:39 PM »

 *sgift*
Quote from: ZzE
Saṅkhitt'ovād: Exhortations in Brief , by Ven. Somdet Phra Wanrut (Tup Buddhasiri), translated from Thai by Ven. Hāsapañño Bhikkhu (2013; p./ KB) [PDF icon]

A skilfully compiled collection of talks that form a progressive discourse on how to understand and practise the Buddha's teachings about meditation.
4
Open Vihara - [Offenes Vihara] / Paramitha vs Merits
« Last post by Johann on August 18, 2017, 07:48:34 AM »
Quote from: asked by Akila Hettiarachchi on BuSe
Paramitha vs Merits

What is the main difference between paramitha (perfection) and merits (pin/kusal)?

Is it the same? Or is a perfection advance? Or are all perfections a merit whereas all merits are not perfections? Which is what?

Nyom Akila,

Actually there is no different at all. One word is merely used in regard of doing (puñña kusala, merits) or in regard of the deeds, while pāramī, perfection, is merely used to object it as the attribute of a person/being, so more often found in parts where there is a seek after the path and more spoken grasping the owner strongly.

It's the deed of merits that form perfection. Either merits nor perfection can be shared like goods but shared be means of letting other take part on deeds, direct or indirect, with it's heart, rejoice in what is conductive for future benefit.

There is merit/perfection needed to gain path and fruits, upanissaya (strong condition cause), but to gain Buddhas ability one needs to gain perfection (more than actually needed for the path and fruits) in all virtures to its highest, so that there are all skills perfect for best possible sharing ones gain in the best way for many in the world, to know all around.

Today are many after becoming a Buddha, yet hardily having the perfection of an "ordinary" disciple, and are not able to perform merits, deeds to gain perfection, that would be enough to even reach the path. That is inasmuch "sad" because we live in a time where the good Dhamma and what counts as skillful and merit, explained by a Buddha, is still avaliable. But this condition (Nissaya) is of cource also a matter of paramis for the individual.

If one has gained perfection needed for the way of Dhamma, latest then one will walk further under leading the holly life.

(Note: This is a gift of Dhamma and not meant for commercial purpose or other wordily gains.)
5
Seldom to come accross a statement of a monk, who obiviously had faith in the Buddhas teaching, put it into practice him self and so gained firm conviction for a travel of no falling back again:

Quote from: A Bhikkhu on DD
Dear Micheal,
I am sorry not having clarified sufficiently what I implied by saying that in the long run the monk wakes up as a priest with the woman next to him. I was surely not referring to Bhikkhu Bodhi. I was intending, though, to draw attention to the current state of other Buddhist traditions such as in Japan or other countries, where monks are not much more than lay priest with an actual woman next to them. This process did not happen overnight or by the violation of just a single rule at one occasion, but is to me an obvious outcome of an attitude of liberal tolerance towards adaptation and change of vinaya rules, being effective over many centuries. The extant nominal vinaya rules of the different tradition are almost identical, which seems to further indicate that a bend in attitude might be responsible for the great variance in the de facto practice (especially in regards to Theravaada in comparison to the other traditions).

I find following simile very telling: If one would take a parallel line and let it extent over a great length, say 200 km, than the lines would not have deviated, preserving accuracy. Take two lines, skewed to each other just about a fraction of a millimeter and let it extent for some length and you will have great variance – continuous little change over time = eventual big change. I believe that to be one reason why the Buddha stated that a factor for the disappearance of the good law is the fact that people cease to observe the vinaya precisely, to see the danger in the slightest fault (as he put it) or even make new rules.

One monk I know argued on similar lines to you in that he said that he would not be able to teach would he not use money in a Western country to travel. I believe that when people really want to receive teaching and you tell them the condition under which you would be, according to vinaya, able to come they would support this. Another possibility would be to simply walk, as they did in the Buddha’s time, a thing absolutely possible even in modern Western societies – I did it succesfully on several occasions without using any money. Similarly it holds true for other instances, bit by bit one adapts and at the end not much is left and – as I said earlier – the monk wakes up with … and not observes even the Paraajikas, a fact already to be observed even in Theravaada communities. Also: If everybody decides for himself what to keep and what not to keep there will be a lot of confusion and also soon not much left. Therefore I, for one, maintain that it would be best to just heed what the Buddha taught originally in regard to preserving and decline of dhamma and vinaya. It is possible even in modern times …

With mettaa
6
Zugang zur Einsicht - [Access to Insight] / Wanrut, Somdet Phra (Tup Buddhasiri)
« Last post by Johann on August 17, 2017, 04:15:57 PM »

 *sgift*
Quote from: ZzE
Wanrut, Somdet Phra (Tup Buddhasiri) (1806-1891)
Somdet Phra Wanrut (Tup Buddhasiri) wurde am 6. Nov. 1806, im Gebiet der neu angelegten Hauptstadt Bangkok geboren, zu dieser Zeit auf der Westseite des Chao Phraya Flusses in Thonburi, während der Egierungzeit des ersten Königs der gegenwärtigen Dynastie (‘Ratanakosin’ Era genannt). Als junger Bursche war er so brilliant in seinem Studium, daß er bald königliche Unterstützung erhielt. Als begnadeter Gelehrter, während immer noch Jugendlicher, würde er Prinz Mongkut vorgestellt, und wurde zu seinem Freund und Tutor. Im Alter von Zwanzig ließ er sich einweihen, so wie dies Prinz Mongkut tat. Ein paar Jahre später ließ ihre Inspiration gegenüber dem Stab der Mönce in Siam nach. Mon-Mönchen, des Rāmaṇa Nikāya, begegnet, welche strikt und zuversichtlich im Ausüben der Mönche Klösterlichen Verhaltensregeln waren, ließen sie sich unter ihnen wiedereinweihen. Zusammen mit einem starken Interesse im studieren der Originallehren des Buddha in Pāli-Schriften, wuchs dieser Akt zu einer vollständigen Reformbewegung in thailands Buddhismus, dem Dhammayuttika Nikāya.

Somdet Phra Wanrut war einer der respektiertesten und einflußreichsten Mönche dieser Bewegung, und sein Ansehen wuchs, so wie die Zeit voran schreitete. Er war für sein exzellentes Wissen, seine strenge Vinaya, seine Hingabe zu wanderntem 'Tudong' in der Trockenzeit (dies enthielt ihm davor anerkannt für sein Wissen in Pāli zu werden, da er in der Staatsprüfungszeit stets auf Wanderschaft in den Wäldern war) und für seine außergewöhnliche Diszipliniertheit in seiner Meditatiinsausübung. Somdat Phra Wanrut verließ sein Leben am 4. Nov. 1891.

(Da ist oft eine Missvorstellung, daß die Thailändische Waldtradition von Luang Pu Sao und Luang Pu Mun eine 'antiintellektuelle' ist. Es ist wahr, daß beide Lehrer ihren Schülern stets nahe legten, sich nicht zu sehr auf Wissen, erlangt durch Studium, zu stützen. Doch sie sandten oft junge Mönche nach Ubon, um grundlegendes Wissen über des Buddhas Lehren zu erlangen, bevor sie ihnen erlaubten langere Zeit im Wald zu verbringen. Luang Pu Sao und Luang Pu Mun selbst zogen unermesslichen Nutzen aus den Einweisungen die sie erhielten, und diese Reihe an Einweisungen gehen im Kern auf die Reformanstrengungen, wie diese von Somdet Phra Wanrut, zurück.)
— von des Ehrw.. Hāsapañño Bhikkhus Einleitung in Saṅkhitt'ovād: Belehrung in Kürze

Wanrut, Somdet Phra (Tup Buddhasiri) (1806-1891)
[Wanrut]Somdet Phra Wanrut (Tup Buddhasiri) was born on 6. Nov. 1806 in the area of the newly established capital of Bangkok, at that time situated on the western side of the Chao Phraya River in Thonburi, during the reign of the first King of the present dynasty (called in Thai the ‘Ratanakosin’ Era). As a young boy, he was so brilliant in his studies that he started receiving royal patronage. He began studying Pāli as a boy even before he ordained as a novice. As a gifted scholar while still a teenager, he was introduced to Prince Mongkut and became his friend and tutor. At the age of twenty, he ordained as a monk as did Prince Mongkut. After a few years, they became uninspired by the state of the monkhood in Siam. Coming across Mon monks of the Rāmaṇa Nikāya who were strict and faithful in their practise of the monks’ monastic code, they reordained. Together with a strong interest in studying the original teachings of the Buddha in the Pāli scriptures, this germinal act blossomed into a full-on reform movement in Thai Buddhism – the Dhammayuttika Nikāya.

Somdet Phra Wanrut was one of the most respected and influential monks in this movement, and his stature only grew as time went on. He was known for his brilliant scholarship, his strict Vinaya, his devotion to wandering ‘tudong’ in the dry season (this actually prevented him from becoming recognised for his knowledge of Pāli, since he was always wandering in the forests and jungles during the times of the state examinations) and his incredibly disciplined meditation practise. Somdat Phra Wanrut left his life on 4. Nov. 1891.

(There is often a misconception that the Thai Wilderness Tradition of Luang Pu Sao and Luang Pu Mun is ‘anti-intellectual’. It is true that both teachers would tell their disciples not to rely too much on knowledge gained from study. However, they would often send young monks to Ubon to gain a basic foundation in the Buddha’s teachings, learning the basics of how to frame their investigations, before letting them spend too much time in the forest. Luang Pu Sao and Luang Pu Mun themselves had benefitted immeasurably from the instruction they had received, and this line of instruction goes back essentially to the reform efforts of monks like Somdet Phra Wanrut.)
— From Ven. Hāsapañño Bhikkhu's intoduction in Saṅkhitt'ovād: Exhortations in Brief.
7
Zugang zur Einsicht - [Access to Insight] / The Study of Dhamma in Religion
« Last post by Johann on August 17, 2017, 11:22:34 AM »

 *sgift*
Quote from: ZzE
The Study of Dhamma in Religion , by Ven. Tan Chao Khun Upālī, translated from Thai by Ven. Hāsapañño Bhikkhu (2015; 20p./ KB)  [PDF icon]
On the 100th anniversary of WWI, a voice you don't hear very often: the most famous monk in the country speaking truth to power, and the truth about war, wrapped in the finery of an excellent Dhamma talk.
8
Zugang zur Einsicht - [Access to Insight] / The Natural Character of Awakening
« Last post by Johann on August 17, 2017, 07:43:57 AM »

 *sgift*
Quote from: ZzE
The Natural Character of Awakening , by Ven. Tan Chao Khun Upālī, translated from Thai by Ven. Hāsapañño Bhikkhu (2013; 112 p./ KB)  [PDF icon]
A beautiful and profound book of talks, with a large section of questions and answers.
9
 *sgift*
Quote from: ZzE
Upālī Guṇūpamājahn, Tan Chao Khun (Mahā Jan Siricando) (1856-1932)
In his time, he was the most famous and brilliant monk in Siam. Widely respected by everyone, he was 14 years Luang Pu Mun's senior and was his most important teacher. He was probably the Wilderness Tradition's single biggest benefactor in the early days: he was a true spiritual friend to many, a preceptor for Luang Pu Waen and Luang Pu Dteu, and a powerful advocate for them all in Bangkok, where the elites initially distrusted and reviled them. Luang Pu Mun highly respected and praised him, telling his close disciples that Chao Khun Upālī was an arahant with all the attainments it was possible to have. For all his accomplishments, he was most well known for the excellence of his Dhamma teaching.
— Informatin from Ven. Hāsapañño Bhikkhu

Upālī Guṇūpamājahn, Tan Chao Khun (Mahā Jan Siricando) (1856-1932)
[Upālī Guṇūpamājahn] Zu seiner Zeit war er der berühmteste und hervorragenste Mönch in Siam. Weit respektiert von jedermann, war er 14 Jahre Luang Pu Muns Senior, und sein wichtigster Lehrer. Er wahr wahrscheinlich der Waldtraditions wichtigster einzelner Unterstützer, in ihren frühen Tagen. Er war ein spiritueller Freund für viele, ein Einweiser für Luang Pu Waen und Luang Pu Dteu, und ein kraftvoller Fürsprecher, für allen von ihnen, in Bangkok, wo die Elite ihnen anfänglich misstraute und sie verunglimpfte. Luang Pu Mun respektierte und lobte ihn höchst, seinen engen Schülern erzählend, daß Chao Khun Upālī ein mit allen möglichen Ausstattungen bestückter Arahat war. zu all den guten Nachsagen, war er als hervorragender Dhammalehrer bekannt.
— Angaben vom Ehrw. Hāsapañño Bhikkhu.

Att’attha-cariyā , by Ven. Tan Chao Khun Upālī, translated from Thai by Ven. Hāsapañño Bhikkhu (2015; 11p./ KB) [PDF icon]
The full section of his autobiography in which he relates his own spiritual practise. It gives some interesting and helpful background to the most profound teachings in 'The Natural Character of Awakening'. An excerpt from the Autobiography of Tan Chao Khun Upālī Guṇūpamājahn written in 1926 when he was 70 years old.

Dependent Co-Arising , by Ven. Tan Chao Khun Upālī, translated from Thai by Ven. Hāsapañño Bhikkhu (2015; 8 S./ KB)  [PDF icon]
An unusual talk on the Buddha's most profound teaching, made plain. Some familiarity with Dependent Co-arising is needed to understand and appreciate this talk.
10
Nothing got lost. Don't worry. Its the opposite.
Nichts ist verloren gegangen, keine Sorge. Im Gegenteil.

This topic has been moved to:
Dieses Thema wurde hier hin verschoben: 
 Entrance internal dwellings - [Eingang interne Unterkünfte] .


Das Thema finden Sie nun hier:
The topic you will find now here:
http://sangham.net/index.php?topic=8176.0

Detail introductions will be frequently moved to sub-forum, just visible for members. Please look also:
Genauer Vorstellungen werden von Zeit zu Zeit in Sub-Forum verschoben, daß nur von Mitgliedern einsehbar ist. Lesen Sie bitte auch den:
 nach Further introduction - [Genauere Vorstellung] .
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Talkbox

 

Johann

August 10, 2017, 11:31:40 AM
Wenn jemand Lust hat, oder anderen etwas Gutes oder Besseres tun kann und möchte: Korrekturlesen http://sangham.net/index.php/topic,1018.msg9625.html#msg9625 Baue nach und nach, so gut wie möglich ein auf ZzE.
 

Johann

August 07, 2017, 02:24:55 AM
Einen ausübungsreichen Vollmond-Uposatha and Gelegenheit die Mönche zu besuchen wünscht meine Person.
 

Sophorn

July 25, 2017, 03:59:03 PM
... versteht und womöglich sieht, wenn er nicht den Weg hierher
findet.

Großer Dank an alle im Hintergrund.

Mögen all diese Früchte vielfach zurückkommen und inspirieren.

Ayu vanno sukkham balam

 :-* :-* :-*
 

Sophorn

July 25, 2017, 03:55:25 PM
 :-* :-* :-*
karuna tvay bongkum Preah metschah

Herzliches Hallo an alle nach sehr langem!

Ein herzliches Dankeschön aus tiefsten Herzen an alle, die sich hier aktiv und indirekt hier beteiligen. Vor allem ein großes Sadhu an Bhante, der unvergleichliche Arbeit leistet, die kaum jemand ver
 

Johann

July 24, 2017, 03:15:56 AM
Fehlinvestition: Was immer man nicht in die Juwelen, in den Pfad investiert, ist vergeude Mühe, schnurrr einen fest im Rad des Leidens. Prüfen Sie es!   :) Wiederholungstäter...
 

Johann

July 17, 2017, 01:50:17 AM
Moritz
 

Moritz

July 16, 2017, 02:28:02 PM
Namasakara, Bhante _/\_
 

Johann

July 14, 2017, 07:07:17 AM
Moritz. Gut ihn früh Morgens und nicht bis in den frühen Morgen zu sehen.
 

Moritz

July 14, 2017, 07:03:53 AM
Namasakara, Bhante _/\_
 

Johann

July 13, 2017, 08:12:46 AM
Moritz.
 

Moritz

July 13, 2017, 07:42:39 AM
Chom reap lea
_/\_
 

Moritz

July 13, 2017, 07:40:46 AM
Namasakara, Bhante _/\_
 

Johann

July 08, 2017, 02:26:09 AM
Vor mehr als 2500 Jahen wurde a diesem Vollmondtag das Rad des Dhammas in bewegung gesetzt. Anumodana!
 

Mohan Gnanathilake

July 02, 2017, 08:24:13 AM
Sehr ehrwürdiger Samanera Johann,

ich bedanke mich bei Ihnen für Ihre nette Erklärung.

Dhamma Grüße an Sie aus Sri Lanka!

 

Johann

July 01, 2017, 07:43:41 PM
Nyom Mohan. Besser: "Ich hoffe, daß es Ihnen gut geht." und bestens (ohne suggerieren, wenn interessiert) "Wie geht es Ihnen." Oder: "Möge es Ihnen Gut gehen." (wenn metta ausdrücken wollend)
 

Mohan Gnanathilake

July 01, 2017, 10:43:15 AM
Sehr ehrwürdiger Samanera Johann,

ich glaube, dass es Ihnen gut geht.

Dhamma Grüße an Sie aus Sri Lanka!
 

Mohan Gnanathilake

July 01, 2017, 10:32:46 AM
Werter Micro,
herzliche Grüße aus Sri Lanka nach Deutschland!
 

Johann

July 01, 2017, 10:32:17 AM
Nyom Mohan.
 

Johann

June 25, 2017, 01:38:38 PM
Alles Zufälle. Nissaya. Und wenn da keine starke Grundlagenursache aufkommt, upanissayapaccayena, na dann war's das, und alles is weg. Lebewesen sind Erben ihrer Taten (im Geist, Wort und Körper).
 

Johann

June 25, 2017, 01:27:24 PM
Schwupps und weg. Waffen und Nahrung geholt.

Oh, was sag ich. Wenn man's doch nehmen kann, auch ohne das Gefühl zu nehmen... Unsinn hier. Hat doch keiner interesse Verdienste zu tun.
 

Johann

June 25, 2017, 01:21:28 PM
Mirco. Wie geht es?
 

Johann

June 25, 2017, 01:20:43 PM
Es ist doch viel angenehmer, wenn man sich nehmen kann was und wann immer man will, oder? Warum sollte man sich so viel antun, da sind genügend die Anbieten.
 

Johann

June 14, 2017, 06:45:07 PM
Jetzt aber vorerst. Möge jeder guten Unterhalt (ung) im Dhamma und Stärkung finden uud sich davon reichlich nehmen.
 

Mohan Gnanathilake

June 11, 2017, 08:24:45 AM
Werter Harry,

ich freue mich darüber, nach einigen Monaten wieder auf sangham.net Sie zu grüßen.

Herzliche Grüße aus Sri Lanka nach Deutschland!
 

Johann

June 09, 2017, 05:05:59 PM
Mögen sich alle, möge sich Guest der Uposatha-Einhaltung nicht nur heute annehmen, und glücksverheißende Zeit verbringen.

May all, may Guest not only today observe the Uposatha and spend auspicious time
 

Mohan Gnanathilake

June 03, 2017, 01:48:08 AM
Sehr ehrwürdiger Samanera Johann,

es geht mir zur Zeit gut. Ich glaube, dass es Ihnen auch gut geht.

Dhamma Grüße an Sie aus Sri Lanka!
 

Johann

June 02, 2017, 11:19:32 PM
Wie geht es Upasaka Mohan?
 

Mohan Gnanathilake

June 02, 2017, 10:51:50 PM
Wie sehr ehrwürdiger Samanera Johann geschrieben hat, hatte ich am 10. Mai 2017 meinen  Geburtstag, an dem Tag  in diesem Jahr das Wesakfest gefeiert wurde.
Beste Grüße an Sie aus Sri Lanka!
Mohan Barathi Gnanathilake
 

Johann

June 02, 2017, 12:33:54 PM
Wußte doch, daß so Nahrung immer gefressen werden will.  :)
"Sehr gut, weiter hungern."

Freut das Nyom Marcel wohlauf ist.
 

Marcel

June 02, 2017, 12:20:52 PM
weil "keines" immer noch die bezugnahme auf eines hat!
 

Johann

June 02, 2017, 10:23:46 AM
Wenn zwei mehr als eines sid, warum ist dann keines auch eines?
 

Johann

May 20, 2017, 04:30:26 PM
Moritz
 

Moritz

May 20, 2017, 03:42:08 PM
Namasakara, Bhante. _/\_
 

Johann

May 18, 2017, 09:56:06 AM
Sadhu und Mudita.
 

Moritz

May 18, 2017, 09:53:33 AM
_/\_ _/\_ _/\_
 

Sophorn

May 18, 2017, 09:22:19 AM
 :-* :-* :-*
Wünsche allen einen guten Silatag.
 :-* :-* :-*
 

Johann

May 16, 2017, 01:45:43 PM
Erfreulich
 

Maria

May 16, 2017, 12:09:45 PM
 :-*Werte Sophorn noch am Flughafen getroffen :)
sitzt im Flieger :-*
 

Johann

May 16, 2017, 02:20:58 AM
Ein Dhammatalk, über ein paar Audiofiles, sicher auch gut für ihre Familie, Mutter... http://sangham.net/index.php/topic,7997.0.html
 

Sophorn

May 16, 2017, 02:17:07 AM
 :-* :-* :-*
 

Johann

May 16, 2017, 02:11:44 AM
Vielleicht möchte Nyom Maria sie noch gerne am Flughafen verabschieden, wenn sie von der Gelegenheit weis.
 

Johann

May 16, 2017, 02:08:13 AM
Gute Reise und beste Wünsche an alle.
 

Sophorn

May 16, 2017, 02:04:14 AM
 :-* :-* :-*
 karuna tvay bongkum
kana macht sich in knapp 4h auf den weg nach Wien und dann Richtung K. Ankunft morgen in PP.
gerade ist kana am Sammeln vor der Abreise.
kana wünscht Bhante gute Genesung.
 :-* :-* :-*
 

Johann

May 16, 2017, 01:48:42 AM
Nyom Sophorn. Wieder zurück im Land der Khmer? Mag Reise und Aufenthalt angenehm gewesen sein.
 

Johann

May 10, 2017, 09:51:50 AM
Qi-Van-Chi
 

Johann

May 10, 2017, 01:30:17 AM
Verdienstreiche und befreiende Vesak - Pūjā allen, heute.
 

Johann

May 09, 2017, 09:20:24 AM
Atma will rest a little today and use the "hair cut day" to maintain his body a little for tomorrow's Puja, so see, Moritz has won a whole day today, maybe use it for same. Best wishes!
 

Moritz

May 09, 2017, 08:58:33 AM
Namasakara Bhante.
May you have a good Vesakha Puja!
_/\_
 

Johann

May 08, 2017, 10:43:50 AM
Viel Freude beim Aufräumen und angenehmes "Brotverdienen"
 

Moritz

May 08, 2017, 09:32:47 AM
Muss nun hier aufräumen und bald los Brot verdienen. Wünsche einen angenehmen Tag.
_/\_

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